591: That's Why I Like Computers
11 Jun 2024At WWDC 2024, together at last!
Episode Description:
Our WWDC 2024 recap episode.
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Chapters
WWDC
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Hey everybody, we’re live from California in a hotel room. Good to be back.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey I were here. We’re
⏹️ ▶️ Casey looking at each other. It’s a little creepy because we haven’t done this in a long time. You got a
⏹️ ▶️ John table. We never had a table.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey Yeah, we’re here
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and yeah, well, we have a a couple of hours to talk and we’ll
⏹️ ▶️ Casey go until we drop dead. You know all of us are still mostly on eastern time, so we’ll see how well this goes.
⏹️ ▶️ John Why is Casey so much louder than me?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Because Casey just enunciates more than you.
⏹️ ▶️ John I know whether you got to turn me up
⏹️ ▶️ John right, I got it. I got it.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco I’ll turn case, especially if you’re going to,
⏹️ ▶️ John especially if you can use a live mix.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco I mean yeah, oh yeah, you got not going to
⏹️ ▶️ John be able to correct. I’m going to shove this microphone to my face here. I got you.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco I got you’re up to fifty decibels. That
⏹️ ▶️ John be old and tired. Once I start yelling, it’ll probably be better. Oh my God, I’ll happen eventually
⏹️ ▶️ John locking wheel nuts on this podcast here about it.
⏹️ ▶️ John I have a lot of high dynamic range hdr i’m at hdr
⏹️ ▶️ John already gone through a compressor. Everything is
⏹️ ▶️ John yeah. My whispers are low and my under the my under the breath jokes are low, but then I
⏹️ ▶️ John get excited and i’m loud. That’s what you got to deal with.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John that’s why people like
⏹️ ▶️ Casey vinyl. That’s why people like me. Did you see my socks? Did you see my socks? Look at this? I know this is terrible.
⏹️ ▶️ John to be a records, but they’re all warped because it’s on a sock
⏹️ ▶️ Casey with it, then it’s even more
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John fitting. It’s
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco exactly like the real
⏹️ ▶️ Marco me bus. Oh my God,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I know that’s I know I
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco for being in person. I know see Casey
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I have my shoes off to Margo yeah. I’m just flat gray. Oh you have you have the white a
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey you have the boring champion
⏹️ ▶️ Marco white. I got the flat gray adidas. I got a great
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John pays for a sock comparisons.
⏹️ ▶️ John could smell our feet.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco we walking around in the in the California June heat all day right. I’m they smell fantastic.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Is this a show? Is this what people
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco come in for? Oh yeah.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Okay, I gotta tell you, so we’re at a circular table, right? The table is, I don’t know, what you want, it’s
⏹️ ▶️ Casey three, four feet across, so like a meter-ish for those of you who have other units,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and I had set a capped water bottle on the table between my computer and
⏹️ ▶️ Casey John’s. That water bottle was on the table for three and a half seconds before John,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey which he’s now doing again because
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John I was demonstrating. demonstrated they
⏹️ ▶️ Marco well earlier today
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey on the ground
⏹️ ▶️ Marco earlier today. We were we were sitting on on the ground outside of the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John steve jobs theater lobby, what trying to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco watch the state of the union and we were watching it like there were a big group of us around and we were watching on my
⏹️ ▶️ Marco lap. I put my laptop on the ground and just had the screen going in the speakers up and everything and I and Casey
⏹️ ▶️ Marco had placed a can of diet coke within a foot of my laptop. Oh easily
⏹️ ▶️ Marco three or four inches and I took a picture of it. I didn’t know that, because I thought
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that if this spills onto my laptop evidence, I’m going to want to have this picture just a case.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Fortunately, I’m very lucky that Casey in fact notice. This was a problem and a few minutes later moved it himself.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco He moves it another foot away or so yeah my laptop survive being near a case. He drink
⏹️ ▶️ Casey yeah, because we would have had no recording today. If that had happened, and I don’t know other
⏹️ ▶️ Marco computers in this room you’re
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John It was That’s true.
⏹️ ▶️ John I only have two ports, sorry. All right,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey we should probably get the show on the road. We have a lot to talk about.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So John, the ruling is no followup, is that correct? That’s right, no time. No time.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco WWDC 2024, we are all here,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey as we’ve mentioned. I’m very excited for it. I think I’d mentioned on the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey show, I was exceedingly anxious and nervous about travel. And I will
⏹️ ▶️ Casey just suffice to say, there was no travel issues, everything worked out. I’m a big baby, same as it ever was.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So we’re all here, we’re safe, we’re sound, and we got to the Apple Park entryway,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and we went through and it was all amazing, and John and I, our eyes are as big as saucers
⏹️ ▶️ Casey because we’ve never seen this before. John is now plucking a piece of dust off of my laptop.
⏹️ ▶️ John You don’t have to give a play-by-play of everything I’m doing, I’m just improving your life. So things I can’t do remotely. I’ve missed
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So we go and we got to visit with some other press people, which was
⏹️ ▶️ Casey awesome. It was so lovely for me at least. I presume it’s the same
⏹️ ▶️ Casey for both you guys, but it was so lovely having that time where we were upstairs above
⏹️ ▶️ Casey where the actual event happens and they served us like breakfast and whatnot. And we had some time to just visit with
⏹️ ▶️ Casey a lot of our peers and friends. And it was just very, very cool. And we had a couple hours of that.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And then the show started with what I thought, and admittedly, I am so giddy about everything
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that’s happening right now that I’m going to love everything. but I thought it was a hilarious video
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of Air Force One and Schiller and a bunch of the other presenters, you
⏹️ ▶️ Casey know, in a plane, skydiving out of the plane. I loved when Craig
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Federighi put the helmet on that was his own like hair, that the helmet was in the shape of his
⏹️ ▶️ Casey own hair. It made me laugh quite a bit.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey loved the video. I loved
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey the video. And
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I love her. Although I will say like, first of all, it was amazing that like everyone else’s hair was getting blown around except Craig’s. right, because
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that’s that’s got to stay in place right. I also like I loved having having shiller as the pilot yep,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco but he could not have looked less happy to be there also true.
⏹️ ▶️ John supposed to look old and cranky. I
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco was a thing of the idea. He’s a seed that didn’t leave
⏹️ ▶️ John him because his line is I’m getting too old for this and he said stuff yep an apple video,
⏹️ ▶️ John but you know Phil didn’t want to say that they
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey had me. They had him
⏹️ ▶️ John using a click wheel iPod, which
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco that was cute
⏹️ ▶️ John and odd to his. You know his age is in spring. was in for him came up with the click. Well, you remember
⏹️ ▶️ John oh that was oh, I don’t think I
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco know it was at a meeting Phil
⏹️ ▶️ John Schiller, but it’s public knowledge. It said it somewhere that it was his idea to have a have a rotating wheel on
⏹️ ▶️ John that’s cool. So that’s his little feather in his cap and he’s the he’s the grizzled old veteran there.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco think this video like I what I liked about it is that it it didn’t try to be like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to corporate to over the top to high production. It was just like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco a relatively short, relatively light, cute video just about the event
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and a couple of fun execs. And then that was it. Like there was no like major statement they’re trying to make. They’re not trying
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to be grand and show off how amazing everyone’s lives are being saved by it. Like it was just a nice
⏹️ ▶️ Marco simple like intro to a developer show. Like that video could have been made ten years ago and we would have,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco well, everyone would have, you know, a little bit less gray hair. But not that I could be talking. But like that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I feel like that was more of the spirit of the event than I think many of their more recent efforts with
⏹️ ▶️ Marco these like pre produced fancy videos that have been very much like just like very
⏹️ ▶️ Marco over produced very like over polished over corporate over the top I like this this was a good fit for the event
⏹️ ▶️ John one thing you missed out on if you weren’t here live like we were yay is the like the two minutes when you know
⏹️ ▶️ John Tim Cook and Craig come out on stage and you know just for the live people you don’t see this in the in the movie
⏹️ ▶️ John and Craig introduced it by saying and you know we have so much to announce today we don’t have time for one of our normal
⏹️ ▶️ John like videos where we have this all over. So there’s no no over the top video, no silly things or whatever. We’re just going to get
⏹️ ▶️ John right to the facts. And I think that intro helped, like the undercutting it helped to
⏹️ ▶️ John make that video land better, because I was thinking if I had seen this video at home without hearing Craig’s injure, I’d be like, Oh, another
⏹️ ▶️ John one of these Apple things where they pretend they’re secret agents and do a thing. But because he undercut it so thoroughly and
⏹️ ▶️ John so well live, that when it started playing, and it showed them jumping out of a plane, and it was it’s so clearly
⏹️ ▶️ John like, ridiculous and self deprecating. are now parodying themselves. And that is a much better
⏹️ ▶️ John look than, let’s say, crushing a trombone in a hydraulic press. Yes.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, I mean, it was huge dad energy. But here we are, three dads. So I loved it. But yeah, they
⏹️ ▶️ Casey went just broadly. And we’ll obviously pick apart everything. But broadly, they went real
⏹️ ▶️ Casey fast. And it was apparent pretty quickly that they were moving with a quickness. And
⏹️ ▶️ Casey we were sitting next to each other. And I had Jason Snell to my right.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And Jason pointed out to me, they’re rounding out the main stretch
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of content. And it was 11 o’clock Pacific or something
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John like that. So it was an hour
⏹️ ▶️ John in. They said that in the intro. They had the parachutes open had the name of the OSs. And they said, we’re going to do
⏹️ ▶️ John all of our OSs before we get on to the other stuff. They had something like that. And again, forgive people listening at home. You may have had time to review
⏹️ ▶️ John the keynote video. We have not. We’ve been busy all day. But yeah, that was an interesting approach to just say,
⏹️ ▶️ John the parachutes have the OSs. They’re going to go through all the OSs. And they mentioned AI features. But they always said,
⏹️ ▶️ John like, machine learning. You made notes of it a couple of times. Yep. They would say, oh, there’s a machine learning feature, this, that. But you know, anyway,
⏹️ ▶️ John we’ll get to the big AI stuff at the end. But they wanted to get their OSs out of
⏹️ ▶️ John the way, but there was so much content. Like, Casey was trying to take notes on it, and I was trying to help, and
⏹️ ▶️ John it was going so fast, we couldn’t keep up with typing.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, yeah. It was incredible. So moving through, oh, do we want to do like an overview
⏹️ ▶️ Casey up front, or we just want to plow
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco through? Keynote order. Vision OS. All right.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So well, excuse me, Apple TV Plus.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco That’s right,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco oh yeah, I literally I took a break during the TV plus promo to write an email. I like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m like I had to send this email to him this morning. I’m like this seems like a good time.
⏹️ ▶️ John I’m excited about those shows, but I don’t want to be spoiled on them. You don’t like I’m going to watch the new season of severance
⏹️ ▶️ John and silo no matter what you show me. So I was kind of trying to avert my eyes, but yeah, that was there.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey It was a thing. It was apparently fifth anniversary of apple tv plus. So there was that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco honestly I mean look tv plus. I think it has turned out pretty well. It’s a great service. There’s a lot of great content
⏹️ ▶️ Marco on there and it got exactly as much time during a developer keynote as I should have.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John Yeah, I mean, that’s pretty good. I would argue
⏹️ ▶️ John the time I’d be zero, but
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey yeah, well, yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey although I will say so a little inside baseball and I’m not I can’t resist because it’s my first time. It was
⏹️ ▶️ Casey during during the like big cut sequences.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John Should I use
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey That’s true. I
⏹️ ▶️ John didn’t think about it. We do that. I didn’t even
⏹️ ▶️ Casey think about it. It’s so true, but all my word it was so loud during anything that was like
⏹️ ▶️ Casey not just somebody talking at you. It was astonishingly
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey I have to say it It was
⏹️ ▶️ John so clear that like because actual live Tim Cook comes out on stage and talks to a microphone and then recorded
⏹️ ▶️ John Tim Cook came and they sounded exactly the same.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey That’s true. That’s a good sound system.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So anyway so Vision OS like Mark would set a moment ago. So Mike Rockwell comes out one point five million compatible apps.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I think it was Ben McCarthy had sent me a screenshot of what appeared to be a little baby
⏹️ ▶️ Casey call sheet icon somewhere in the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John mass. I was looking for it. It was I was looking for it. I couldn’t tell. But we
⏹️ ▶️ Casey were seated relatively far away from the screen which that sounds like a complaint. It actually
⏹️ ▶️ Casey wasn’t, it was chosen deliberately.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John We wanted it to be in the shade.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Because we wanted it to be in the shade. And so we were seated fairly far back and I tried to look and I haven’t had the chance
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to go back like one of you just said to look at the video and see it. But that would be my first keynote appearance
⏹️ ▶️ Casey if that’s what happens. So that’s extremely exciting.
⏹️ ▶️ John I guess the ATP podcast was in
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey a session, not in the keynote. You’re right.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Not in the keynote. So anyway, so one and a half million compatible apps. And then we had Haley Allen
⏹️ ▶️ Casey come out to talk about just Vision OS improvements. I’m trying to just skip over the stuff
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that’s not that exciting, and go to the stuff that I find exciting. First of all. Oh, iOS. Oh, stop. Well
⏹️ ▶️ Casey played, but still. So yeah, so converting 2D images into 3D using
⏹️ ▶️ Casey quote, advanced machine learning. I thought that was very cool. We’ll see how it works.
⏹️ ▶️ John it works. It may be garbage, it may be great. I mean,
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco it’s just gotta be the subject detection, right? Yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco yeah, yeah. That’s what we already have. And trying
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John to figure out
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like, you know, how much depth certain subjects would naturally have, and maybe what the side of their head might slightly
⏹️ ▶️ Marco look like. I mean, they’re not the first people to try to do this. It’s gonna be a little weird. I’m sure it will be fine. If they
⏹️ ▶️ Marco do it with great subtlety, it should be fine in most cases.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, like Facebook, I think, I’ve never actually used like this feature, but I believe it has something
⏹️ ▶️ Casey where you can take a 2D video and it’ll do like a parallax effect
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the foreground and the background. I presume to y’all’s point that it’s something like that. They did mention,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and I forget exactly how they were, how they were describing it, but the gist of it was,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it’s very annoying sometimes to try to figure out the battery level and the time on Vision OS.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey What you’re supposed to do today is you look up, up, up, up, up, up, up, and there’s like a little gray
⏹️ ▶️ Casey circle with a down chevron, and then you do a pinch gesture, and that’ll drop down like control center or whatever.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And they say that what you can do is you can flip your hand so your palm up, and it’ll
⏹️ ▶️ Casey detect that and show like time and battery, and then you can flip your hand over for control center, which if
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that works well, I think that’ll be really neat.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco And the home gesture too, that was a big thing.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Because right now to go home, you have to reach your hand up to the physical digital crown on the headset and push it.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And then with this, now that you can just have your hand palm up and squeeze together, I think, or
⏹️ ▶️ Marco There’s some kind of gesture as the home button, which that’s a good improvement. Vision OS, the more you
⏹️ ▶️ Marco can avoid constant hand motion, the less fatiguing it will be over time.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John For all the reason. The control
⏹️ ▶️ John center thing, they put it up high, like it’s balanced. They don’t want it to be in your eye line so you accidentally trigger it,
⏹️ ▶️ John but then they don’t want it to be too high, so it’s annoying, but it is like, it’s kind of important for it to be out of the way, and that’s why I think it’s annoying
⏹️ ▶️ John to go, because the people, you don’t look up that with your eye, especially with your eyeballs, because you can’t just look up with
⏹️ ▶️ John your head. Well, I guess you can, but it’s just.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey No, if you look up with your head, you still got to look up
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John with your eyes. It’s weird.
⏹️ ▶️ John It’s intentionally inaccessible, and the hand gestures seem great. Although I do wonder if they’re kind of, kind of like how you burn, like,
⏹️ ▶️ John you know, command click or whatever in an app, like how many hand gestures are they going to have us
⏹️ ▶️ John you’re five of this thing, we’re making the spells from the
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey one. I was going to say the same thing.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey It’s so true. So, all right. So in the interest of moving along quickly, Mac virtual display, getting some big updates
⏹️ ▶️ Casey later this year, which I am genuinely super excited about. I’m not using my vision pro
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that frequently, although it did on the plane on the way here and it was wonderful. But one of the things I do love about
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it is Mac virtual display. And they’re saying that, again, it was going so fast. I might be flubbing
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the details and that’s true of basically everything we’re about to talk about for the next hour and a half. They said it was a
⏹️ ▶️ Casey much higher display resolution and size. And they said something along the lines
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of, it’s the equivalent of two 4K screens. But the way it was presented was like
⏹️ ▶️ Casey one just obscene, ultra-wide, curved
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John thing. It’s like those
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco monitors, but a virtual
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John version. Yeah, it’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco basically like 8K by 2K or whatever.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And what was interesting about this was, they made brief mention that what’s happening here to make this work and look
⏹️ ▶️ Casey OK is that they’re doing the dynamic foveation stuff that they they do for the entire OS,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey for Vision OS that is, but they’re doing it for Mac virtual display on the Mac.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey they’re live transmitting where your eyes are
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John will render. I think they’re
⏹️ ▶️ John doing that for bandwidth reasons because
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey then they don’t
⏹️ ▶️ John have to send the full resolution
⏹️ ▶️ John the headset. They can just, they can send a crappier version, but with a higher res of where you’re looking, which allows them to,
⏹️ ▶️ John I don’t know what the limitation is. Is it like, is it a video memory or something or whatever the M2’s limits are?
⏹️ ▶️ John But it’s clear that if they could have just said, OK, well, just you got a bigger screen now and just not deal with this. They would have
⏹️ ▶️ John done it. But this is more complicated. So.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, yeah, very much so. And then it was funny. I have not looked at Mastodon all day. But I did see a handful of people
⏹️ ▶️ Casey send me a text as soon as they mentioned that train support is now support or will be supported in travel mode.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey It’s hilarious to me that an American, of all people, is the one who is known for using the Vision Pro on the train. But here
⏹️ ▶️ Marco only Americans can buy it
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey so far. I guess that’s true. That’s a good point.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco All right, I take it all back. Although soon, they’ll be opening in other countries.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey Yeah, that’s true.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And so actually we can we can jump right over there. I mean, it’s just very quickly There’s apparently going to be a physical lens for
⏹️ ▶️ Casey certain Canon cameras I don’t know Marco if you call it which models
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco it yeah They
⏹️ ▶️ Marco for the for the eos r7 can has this whole new line of the mirrorless cameras that replace other big ones The r7 is you
⏹️ ▶️ Marco know, one of the big great ones and there’s a new Canon spatial lens that will allow native
⏹️ ▶️ Marco spatial video capture They say Final Cut Pro for Mac can edit it. They said specifically for Mac. So
⏹️ ▶️ Marco too bad for the iPad people and it’s viewable in the new vimeo app provision os
⏹️ ▶️ Marco which is interesting and then they also announced some deals integration with black magic and da vinci
⏹️ ▶️ Marco resolve for apple immersive video that’s the hundred eighty degree field of view with the 8k res
⏹️ ▶️ Marco for for production of that so they’re based and then they said there’s new apple immersive video content
⏹️ ▶️ Marco so we will very slowly have new stuff coming to the vision pro great I I mean, and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco what’s interesting, too, is like almost everything else we’re going to talk about it like they were very
⏹️ ▶️ Marco clear. They kept saying that, you know, all these like new AI features and everything are coming to quote a Mac,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco iPhone and iPad. Yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it was very clear. None of this stuff is coming to vision OS, at least not yet. And the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco only reason I can think like there, it has the hardware, it has an M two and that’s, you know, they, it goes down to M one, iPads
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and Macs. So we know it’s, it’s like, you know, the hardware is compatible. So I guess the only reason is like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco they just haven’t gotten to it.
⏹️ ▶️ John think those code bases are just too far diverged. Like if you think about photos on Vision OS, that’s
⏹️ ▶️ John not a shared code base with the other platforms.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Why not? When they made it, they knew they were going to have to unify
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco it’s, you know, they
⏹️ ▶️ John were so isolated for so long that there’s enough of a divergence and they have to work on their 2.0 features that
⏹️ ▶️ John I kind of understand why they didn’t get it. I’m assuming they will eventually as they converge further. But
⏹️ ▶️ John right now, it kind of makes sense to me.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think the Vision Pro user base, such as it is, probably
⏹️ ▶️ Marco really needs to see signs of support from Apple. And I don’t think they really got
⏹️ ▶️ Marco a lot of that today. I think they got a small amount of support, but all the cool features that they
⏹️ ▶️ Marco demoed for everything else, all their other platforms, really, or all their other major platforms,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco none of it’s available for Vision OS. And I think that’s kind of a weird miss at this point. Well, the
⏹️ ▶️ John rumor was that they that, you know, Craig Federico got religion about chat GPT in 2022. So that gave
⏹️ ▶️ John all the other platforms two years to be figuring
⏹️ ▶️ John out how they’re going to integrate this and vision pro hadn’t even shipped at that point is but it’s only been out for whatever,
⏹️ ▶️ John four, six months, like, they’re just behind. I, you know, it’s kind of a shame
⏹️ ▶️ John because they really want to promote this. I knew that vision Pro I had it as the very first item in the schedule.
⏹️ ▶️ John I didn’t predict that TV plus would be in there. You know, I know they want to talk about it because it’s their latest platform, but to
⏹️ ▶️ John your point, Marco, they had the least to say about it. It’s not in on this party, kind of like me with my
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, well, just very briefly, I wonder if, because obviously an M2 is,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey on the surface, it supports all this new Apple intelligence stuff, which we’ll talk about later, but I can’t help
⏹️ ▶️ Casey but wonder, it seems like the Vision Pro is running at the edge of what the M2 is capable
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of, just doing normal Vision Pro stuff. I almost wonder if there just wasn’t enough, not literal
⏹️ ▶️ Casey bandwidth, but figurative bandwidth to layer all this other
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John junk on top. It’s got
⏹️ ▶️ John the R1 doing a lot of stuff there.
⏹️ ▶️ John that’s true. That’s a good
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah. And the M2 is very strong. I don’t think that’s the problem.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think it’s just about they just didn’t have the time or the software resources. I don’t
⏹️ ▶️ John Half the apps that the AI stuff integrates with weren’t even native in the first 1.0.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey So maybe it will get it then.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco It should make it easier, actually. Just
⏹️ ▶️ Marco here, run the iPad version.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So anyway, so yeah, to wrap up Vision Pro, I tried to copy down the countries and when, and I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey failed miserably, so I don’t have details. But suffice to say, there’s a handful of countries, sometime
⏹️ ▶️ Casey in the next couple of weeks,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco few weeks, I think. Yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco June 28th was China, Japan, and Singapore.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey And then July 12th
⏹️ ▶️ Marco was Australia, Canada, France, Germany, and then there was one other one that I went by too fast
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey for me to write down. Exactly,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey exactly. So I mean, this to me was a B. You know, like it was good.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey There was nothing that really wowed me. There’s nothing that made me think, oh, thank God, this is going to
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John change. And you
⏹️ ▶️ John think, again, we’re talking about this day of. There’s got to be more.
⏹️ ▶️ John didn’t fit into the keynote. Once people install these betas in future episodes, we’ll talk about how you can rearrange icons
⏹️ ▶️ John in the home screen. They just didn’t make the keynote or whatever.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, but this was acceptable. I wasn’t overly jazzed about this. I am pretty
⏹️ ▶️ Casey jazzed about Mac virtual display, to be honest with you, but it didn’t seem to take away any of the problems
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that people are having with Vision OS in terms of how difficult it is for text entry, for example. So
⏹️ ▶️ Casey we’ll see what happens.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco If you didn’t like Vision OS before, you still won’t like it. If you
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey liked it before,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you have a few improvements, some of which might mean a lot to you, most of which probably won’t. Yeah, exactly
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WWDC
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Ios eighteen baby. So do we do we want to have a sidebar about
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the the German rumor thing or do we
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco want to put that aside?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’ll tell you what so I’m obviously leading up German always has lots of rumors right there was that he basically had
⏹️ ▶️ Marco a ton of info right beforehand. I didn’t even look at it because I was at this point like we were so close.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think I was already on the plane when it came out and I’m like I don’t even I don’t even want to be spoiled at this point. I’m close
⏹️ ▶️ Marco enough now. I’m like I’m in the mode. I’m in like the very like, you know, theatrical like I want to I want to see the performance.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So you know I don’t whatever he got like I’ve since heard afterwards.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco He has very impressive sourcing. Obviously, he he really is dominating the entire rumor game
⏹️ ▶️ Marco almost entirely by himself. I am glad that he provides us content throughout the year to talk
⏹️ ▶️ Marco about, but when it comes down to like two days beforehand dumping an entire presentation, I don’t
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I don’t find a lot of value in that, to be honest. Yeah, so you know, I recognize
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m not this is not the universal opinion of everybody, whoever, you know, reads news sites, and we’ve certainly been guilty
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of, you know, seeing these things ourselves and having fun with them sometimes. But there’s a there’s like a certain limit on
⏹️ ▶️ Marco how much I want things to be spoiled, and that that was that seemed like it was past it for me.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey fair. So anyway, so a lot of this we already knew if we had read the Mark Gurman report,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey but starts with the home screen, you can rearrange icons on springboard. So they had a picture
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of a dog, if I recall correctly. Dog’s head is in like the upper left-hand corner of the home screen as,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I’m sorry, the dog was like the background of the home screen or what have you. Dog’s head is in the upper left. So Craig arranges,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you know, icons. I think maybe there was a top row laterally and then there was a bunch of icons on the right-hand
⏹️ ▶️ Casey side and then some icons on the bottom. And it seemed like it was relatively easy.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Like whatever the new jiggle mode is, it seemed that whatever he did, he did it quickly. And I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey don’t think it was like a sequence is shortened sort of situation.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco Although he
⏹️ ▶️ Marco didn’t show how he picked up a bunch of app icons somehow. And then he just showed him dropping a
⏹️ ▶️ John The normal way where you drag one and then you tap a bunch of other ones and they join the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco group, right? He probably should have shown that just because most people don’t even know you can do that. Yeah, it is kind
⏹️ ▶️ John of complicated. But I mean, so we talk about the difficulty of rearranging icons in the home screen. And obviously people do want to leave spaces
⏹️ ▶️ John and they’ve been using spacer icons and this helps them for that. But if you can
⏹️ ▶️ John clear space on any of your screens, this should make it easy, slightly easier to rearrange, because
⏹️ ▶️ John one of the most annoying things is how they, whatever you do, it wants to fill the hole. Like it’ll pull one from
⏹️ ▶️ John the previous screen and they all just want to, like, they just want to compress into this big, you know, like
⏹️ ▶️ John you can’t leave holes. You can’t, if you know you’re going to put something in a spot, there’s no way to leave that spot open. And that
⏹️ ▶️ John makes it so difficult. And that’s why, like when you, you know, you remove an icon, everything shuffles up and
⏹️ ▶️ John then one from the previous screen goes and shuffles in. I hope that what the way they’ve done it has made the icons
⏹️ ▶️ John less obsessed with being right next to each other, where you can actually make holes, because that’s the point of this feature. And I know
⏹️ ▶️ John people want this. So you know, good job in I was 18, the 18th version of the phone operating system
⏹️ ▶️ John by allowing people to do something that they’ve been doing for years and years using blank icons.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Indeed. So they also announced that icons will darken in in dark mode. And
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the implication, and from what little I’ve gleaned since the keynote, is that this does not
⏹️ ▶️ Casey require developer input. Although I think we’ve since learned that you can
⏹️ ▶️ Casey provide alternative versions of your icon. And then additionally, you can customize
⏹️ ▶️ Casey all of your icons collectively in one shot with a tint color. And
⏹️ ▶️ Casey again, now I’m not so clear what developer input
⏹️ ▶️ Casey is required for that. or do they do it all magically? I think we had seen a screenshot that
⏹️ ▶️ Casey one of our friends had taken of their home screen with a red tint, and that was with
⏹️ ▶️ Casey today’s icons. So that makes me think you don’t have to opt into it as a developer.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco It seems like you can opt in as a developer and provide them with separate icon assets that are
⏹️ ▶️ Marco maybe more optimized for it. But even if you don’t, they will still do it anyway. Which I think, this is what we were saying
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the other week, that we were saying, wow, it kind of seems like that would be a bit risky with like big brand recognition
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and things, but they did it anyway, and so I think that’s a it’s a great move for users.
⏹️ ▶️ John Do we know if it’s like every home screen when you pick this color? Is it per
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco home? I don’t know
⏹️ ▶️ John I’d originally thought when this rumor I thought it was per icon, but that seems to be not the case right. They only showed whole homes
⏹️ ▶️ John home screens were like all the icons right
⏹️ ▶️ Marco as I know it’s the entire screen,
⏹️ ▶️ John but it is it per like if I go to a different page, we’ll find out, but it’s interesting like and the way they look like they’re
⏹️ ▶️ John doing it. I don’t know if this is how they’re doing it, but it looks as if they turn all the icons black and white and then all the things
⏹️ ▶️ John that were whitish become pinkish become green issue or whatever. Like that’s what it looks like if you don’t have any
⏹️ ▶️ John sort of customization. That’s how it tints your icons and that’s not going to look great in some cases. And you know, it’s
⏹️ ▶️ John like my my main objection to this feature is that I just don’t think it would be attractive. Like I think people should be
⏹️ ▶️ John able to change their icons to whatever they want and they can with the stupid shortcut thing, which is annoying. Just make whatever
⏹️ ▶️ John icon you want. Make a shortcut. You could pick any icon you want. It would be nice if you could sort of just hold on an icon
⏹️ ▶️ John and say I want to change this icon and here’s what I want to change it to. But that’s not really this feature.
⏹️ ▶️ John It’s tinting, it’s developer support for, you know, custom icons for dark mode, and it’s so
⏹️ ▶️ John you can give your home screens a theme. And they, and it will pick the theme based on your background. If your background
⏹️ ▶️ John is yellowish, it will make all your icons yellowish and so on. So I, you know, and apparently there’s an Android
⏹️ ▶️ John feature that is very, very similar to this. So it makes sense that they pull this out because it’s a kind of like a switching feature, like people on Android
⏹️ ▶️ John are used to being able to do this. Now they can do it on iOS too.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, and I think they did this in a very Apple way. Like, you know, there’s this whole industry out there of
⏹️ ▶️ Marco these apps that let people customize their home screens. And they do it through, as we mentioned, you know, all these ridiculous hacks
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to get that, to be able to do per icon customization and, you know, to arbitrary icons.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco You know, you can have all these apps that will help you install a really aesthetic theme for your home screen. And
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you can have this, and it’ll show you hundreds of things. You can buy packs of them and everything. And they work through all these,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you know, terrible means. What Apple did here is not remove the need for all those apps and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco not remove their market at all. What they did here was give you like the 20% solution. It’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like, here, if you want to customize your home screen, okay, we’ll give you this very limited,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like guard railed, safe way to do it. And we’ll give you these, you know, these 10 options that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you can pick or whatever. Although actually the free form color picker was nice, but like, you know, we’re going to give you these, these very
⏹️ ▶️ Marco limited controls. You can do a small subset of customization. It’s still very gated,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco very limited, very safe, but we will let you do this. And so that’s gonna be great. A lot
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of people are gonna do that. And at the same time, it’s not gonna at all affect the market for the apps that go way further
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep, yeah, I mean, we’ll see what happens with it, but I’m excited because it seems like there’s a need
⏹️ ▶️ Casey for this or want for this, if nothing else, and now Apple’s satisfying it. You’re
⏹️ ▶️ Casey make your whole home screen yellow? No, no, I’m not.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey would match your car if it did. Control center. So you’re going to be able to swipe vertically between
⏹️ ▶️ Casey different pages. And what I thought was most interesting is that, and this was the beginning of, I feel like we
⏹️ ▶️ Casey heard a lot about the Intents API and several places that it becomes important. And I think Marco,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you had said over the last few weeks or months that you saw this, you know, this, the tea
⏹️ ▶️ Casey leaves pointing this way, and it sure seems like you were dead right. So anyways, third parties can donate
⏹️ ▶️ Casey controls to Control Center, which is really, really fun. So the canonical example that they used was like, hey, if you
⏹️ ▶️ Casey have a Ford and you can unlock your Ford remotely, well, if the Ford app supports it,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you can have a control center icon that is unlock
⏹️ ▶️ Casey my car. And then they additionally said that lock screen controls are now going
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to be swipable, which I think is very interesting and exciting. And
⏹️ ▶️ Casey although I don’t remember if it was mentioned here, while I’m thinking of it, another thing that they mentioned at some point today was
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that third party camera apps, there will be an API to have a third-party camera app work while
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the phone is locked. Correct. And that is tremendous news for my dear friend Ben
⏹️ ▶️ Casey McCarthy and a lot of other people who have third-party camera apps. Because that is a real stumbling
⏹️ ▶️ Casey point. Because the fastest way to use a, when you’re trying to take a
⏹️ ▶️ Casey photo, you want to do it immediately. And you don’t want to unlock your phone and blah, blah, blah. So that’s really exciting as well.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, this now gives people the full capability to have third-party camera apps that replace the camera button
⏹️ ▶️ Marco on the lock screen and work while the camera is still locked right. That’s all very new and that’s yeah for third
⏹️ ▶️ Marco party camera apps. That’s huge
⏹️ ▶️ John and presumably also the swipe gesture on the lock screen. If you don’t want to hold down on the camera icon, you can just swipe sideways. That will also
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco configurable. Do you
⏹️ ▶️ John know I don’t it would be really weird if you held down on the icon. I got one camera app and swiped and
⏹️ ▶️ Casey we will see what happens
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and control center integration to like and the way this is all built on widgets like this. We’ve been seeing
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the building blocks here for a while. The The modern widget system powers so many things
⏹️ ▶️ Marco all across the system. As far as we can tell, I haven’t dove too far into it yet, but as far as we can tell,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco all of this control center stuff is all just basically widgets in a new place. It does inherit the same
⏹️ ▶️ Marco seeming limitations of widgets. Hopefully we’ll have some follow-up next week with details
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of this, but it does seem like if you have, say, an app running a thing in control center
⏹️ ▶️ Marco with one of these new blocks in control center, the app is not constantly running in the background.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco might be hard to do things like make a rich now playing widget for my
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey for audio apps. For
⏹️ ▶️ Marco instance, it’s very similar to other widgets seemingly in that it supports things like buttons and toggles
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that kind of wake the app up when they are hit and then go back and then make the app go back to sleep. So it’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it’s going to be a little bit limited, but I’m really glad they’re doing this and what what’s interesting, though, is like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that kind of to some degree might replace widgets on like because you can currently
⏹️ ▶️ Marco pull down like the widget screen or you can swipe over to the widget page like there’s there are certain places like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you can kind of now have widgets in like three different directions of
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John swiping on the phone.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think it might be might get a little confusing as to like where you’re going to put certain things or like end up on the wrong page.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I don’t know. But I’m glad to have this, you know, even if it’s maybe getting a little
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, yeah. They talked about privacy for a while. They said that one of the things
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you might want to do is put face or touch ID or passcode in front of apps
⏹️ ▶️ Casey so you can only open the Photos app, for example, if you authenticate.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey They also said you can hide an app entirely. I missed how you would access it. Maybe you’re searching for
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco it, I’m not sure. It
⏹️ ▶️ Marco shows up in the app library. And there’s a special hidden apps block on the bottom of the app library.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And it didn’t show it in a locked state. But we assume you just Face ID probably to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco unlock that block, and then you can access
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey the app. That’s like
⏹️ ▶️ Casey deleted photos in the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco Photos. Yeah, and hidden
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John photo, the hidden album. It
⏹️ ▶️ Marco basically works like the hidden album, it looks like.
⏹️ ▶️ John It’s kind of weird how and well, I guess it’s two things, right? So one is protecting
⏹️ ▶️ John an app and you could do that individually. The apps and you’re like, great, the features done and the other is hiding the fact that that app is on your
⏹️ ▶️ John phone at all because the apps that you tap and they face ID, you can still see the icon to the app and you’re right. They didn’t show it
⏹️ ▶️ John in the presentation, but I assume the hidden apps app library folder doesn’t even show you which apps are in it when it’s in
⏹️ ▶️ John the lock state. I would hope not. Right. And so that’s that’s why there’s both of these features. It’s not just like, oh, if you don’t want to
⏹️ ▶️ John individually lock apps, you could just into this folder and they’re all locked? No, it’s to hide the fact that the app is on your
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep. They also said, and this is a long time coming, but I’m very happy for it,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you can restrict what contacts are being exposed to apps. So there was a big brouhaha a few years ago
⏹️ ▶️ Casey where we realized, I don’t remember what app, it doesn’t matter, but there was some app that wanted to slurp up all your contacts.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Wasn’t it Path? I wanted to say that, but I think it was after Path. But you very well could be right. It doesn’t really
⏹️ ▶️ Casey matter. One way or another, it slurped up all your contacts, which could have been for reasonable reasons, but
⏹️ ▶️ Casey ultimately what it ended up doing was spamming all your contacts, saying, oh, you should join Path, or whatever it was.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And that was really gross. And ever since then, I, at least, and I think many others, have been really reluctant
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to let an app slurp up all your contacts, which I think is good to be reluctant about it. Now,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey apparently, there’s going to be some sort of API where you can say, I guess, again, in the vein of photos, what
⏹️ ▶️ Casey contacts would you like to expose to such and such an app, which is great. I’m here for it.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, because before there used to be no API at all to contact us. It was just a public API. And
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that I think that’s when a lot of these apps were really abusing it. And so this, this, it’s great to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco see this, because there are so many apps where, like, in order to do some critical functionality, it requests
⏹️ ▶️ Marco access to your entire address book. Sometimes it actually requires it in ways that I think
⏹️ ▶️ Marco are not actually necessary. And that app review should take a look at like WhatsApp, for instance, small
⏹️ ▶️ Marco app, no one’s really heard of it. But it’s nice to see Apple putting a little more attention
⏹️ ▶️ Marco on contact privacy.
⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah, I see that in some apps, and sometimes I can see like, you wanna be able to like, say it’s an app where you’re gonna have to
⏹️ ▶️ John type people’s email addresses or contact information, you want it auto-completed, right? I understand, like,
⏹️ ▶️ John I want this app to build up a database of all the contacts so I can auto-complete. But you don’t want the
⏹️ ▶️ John app to actually have all your contact info. I wonder if there’s some privacy preserving way that they could like vend
⏹️ ▶️ John a contact auto-complete typing. I don’t know, it’s a complicated
⏹️ ▶️ Marco They easily could for like the system text inputs, but I think the reality is in the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco app landscape we live in, no app would ever use that. They would just request access to your entire
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John contact book and use it for marketing. They
⏹️ ▶️ John keep nagging you about it every time you launch the app. You sure you don’t want to give me access to all your contacts, are you sure?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, and they would gate some critical functionality behind it and app review wouldn’t have a problem with it. They should, but they won’t.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right, so we talk about messages. Tap backs could be any emoji.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Finally. Finally. I’m very excited about this, truly I am. I’m a little worried what
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I don’t think they did a great job of showing what the user interface is going to look like. So I’m a little nervous. It’s going to be super clunky.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I’m going on faith that it won’t be, but assuming it’s not clunky, I am here for it. Very excited.
⏹️ ▶️ John That’s a good point because the one good thing about the limited set is you don’t have to go through like a giant picker. You know, their emoji
⏹️ ▶️ John picker has gotten better, but it’s still sometimes cumbersome.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco Yeah. I mean, really.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And one thing I also loved, obviously, yeah, finally the emoji, uh, everyone’s been wanting that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco for how many years now and every other chat app does it and it’s great and you know slack whatsapp
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like every there’s so many other apps people are using that just have free form emoji response of things. It has become
⏹️ ▶️ Marco a language that people like people expect to have that, so that’s good. I also I love the day did
⏹️ ▶️ Marco bullet Alec underline strike through yep and then they have they have send later because interestingly they use the example
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of like if somebody if you want to like send somebody a happy birthday message in the morning you know you can you can schedule it at night
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and it’ll go that morning. You can just have a I send it
⏹️ ▶️ John to send it yourself.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco You’re getting ahead, man. You’re getting ahead. Well, then you can have their AI read all their birthday messages
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John and just summarize it for you. And say
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it, yeah. Easy peasy. All right, let’s stay positive. So there’s also text formatting. I’m sorry, you said text
⏹️ ▶️ Casey formatting. It’s the text effects. There’s magnification, animation, a blow away. We couldn’t have
⏹️ ▶️ Casey a keynote without blow away referenced some way, somehow. Again, this sounds cool
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and interesting. I’m a little worried and skeptical about the interface in order to do it because like text selection
⏹️ ▶️ Casey on iOS, Not fun, which I don’t know how it could be fun without a full physical keyboard.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So I’m not like faulting them for that, but I don’t know, this seems like it might be more effort than it’s worth. Um, something that
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I thought was very, very interesting, particularly sitting directly in front of underscore actually
⏹️ ▶️ Casey was, uh, messages via satellite. So to, to back up a half step, you can send emergency
⏹️ ▶️ Casey messages via satellite. Like you can, there’s a wizard you would walk through that says, why are you hurt or you stranded, whatever,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you know, are you safe, et cetera, et cetera. and it would basically write a message, not in an AI
⏹️ ▶️ Casey way, just like, so Casey is hurt on the side of the road and he’s at such and such lat and long,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey go help him. More of a Mad Libs way.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that’s a good way of putting it. That’s a very good way of putting it. Well, now you can do full honest
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to goodness messages, like you type your message and send it via satellite, which I think is great.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, it’s almost, it’s core messages or core features of iMessage
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey Yeah, that’s true, because it
⏹️ ▶️ Marco was like tap backs as
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey well, wasn’t
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it? Yeah, so it said so now you know since the F one fourteen you’ve been able to do those emerging messages, but it was like emergency
⏹️ ▶️ Marco only now when you are connected only by satellite you can do you can text seemingly
⏹️ ▶️ Marco anybody they have SMS support and then for I message they said key I message features
⏹️ ▶️ Marco whatever that means, but they said it includes sending receiving messages emoji and tap backs like that’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you know so obviously probably not like photos and stuff, but that’s that’s pretty cool. Like it’s basically
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like free unlimited satellite texting
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John with any iPhone?
⏹️ ▶️ John They didn’t mention any money, but I do.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I mean, all they said was works with iPhone 14
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey or later. I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey mean, I take your point. I think they’re just kicking that can down the road until they figure out what they’re going to do about charging for
⏹️ ▶️ Marco But it’s got to be free. Well, maybe they would do emergency for free.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey That’s a good point.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And then this new feature maybe will be part
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John of some plus point.
⏹️ ▶️ John Same thing we were talking about in the keynote, which
⏹️ ▶️ Casey is weird. I know. What are you going to do? Mails, getting on-device categorization. So this is where you filter in the,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Gmail’s had this for how many years, John?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John Yeah, but I do
⏹️ ▶️ John not use it in Gmail. But
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I mean, in the times I used it, actually, Hey, when Hey was new and exciting,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John a lot of people were really interested in that. It had its own little
⏹️ ▶️ John cute categorization. Right, exactly. The key feature of this categorization thing is what are the categories? And
⏹️ ▶️ John it’s not like the user can pick them. It’s basically the person who makes the app has to decide, what are the categories
⏹️ ▶️ John of email that people get that they think would be useful to put into bins? And then they have whatever machine learning thing puts them into these bins.
⏹️ ▶️ John So here are the bins that Apple chose.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I mean, there’s no reason that has to be fixed. like Apple has, I think, chosen to make it fixed, but you could do things like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco make a tagging system and then have the system automatically file into those tags. I don’t know if they’re
⏹️ ▶️ John yeah, I don’t mean just the word, I mean like the analysis of the message to say what kind of message in it. So Apple’s things are what?
⏹️ ▶️ John Primary, transactions, updates, and promotions. Is that all
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco of it? I think it was. Promotions was a
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John euphemism for that. Yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ John well, I mean, everyone has some promotions. It’s stuff that’s not spam or whatever, but like transactions make some sense.
⏹️ ▶️ John People wanna have receipts. Primary is like the catch-all for the important messages. and then updates
⏹️ ▶️ John is newsletters and social media. I don’t know. I always find it like I find it more work for me to think about
⏹️ ▶️ John what bucket this thing would be, and even though in gmail like gmail’s buckets, it can be in five all the buckets at the same time,
⏹️ ▶️ John because they’re not folders like it’s tagging system right, but I think this
⏹️ ▶️ John a lot of people feel like they don’t have any tools to manage their email,
⏹️ ▶️ John even when they do, because the tools are complicated or require setup that nerds will do, but people won’t. They just
⏹️ ▶️ John go to their inbox and they just flail and they leave right and this at least like
⏹️ ▶️ John this will at first it’s going to annoy people like where’s my email it’s in these categories. I don’t care about it,
⏹️ ▶️ John but as long as it can be disabled, that’s fine and for the people who do find this useful to be like
⏹️ ▶️ John oh now something else is organizing my email for me and they will learn where to look for
⏹️ ▶️ John certain things like this gmail does it a lot of other email clients do it. Obviously people find it useful. This
⏹️ ▶️ John is an apple catch up feature. I think it’s important for them to have this. I just hope they allow everything
⏹️ ▶️ John people in my life there if they install this operating system and they say where all my email go. I don’t know what primary is
⏹️ ▶️ John that’s a bad sign, but we’ll see how it goes.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m also curious they had that the digest view per sender and it seems like it was like they
⏹️ ▶️ Marco had like custom header images for companies
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that I don’t know how that like are they defining some new standard of like if you
⏹️ ▶️ John it from the emails.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I don’t know yeah that that was that That seemed a little gross to me, but I don’t know.
⏹️ ▶️ John It’s pretty harmless. I wonder if all this stuff will work on Apple’s email. So they’re going to put all their own stuff into primary when they
⏹️ ▶️ John us about the latest sale on MacBook Pros or the WWDC developer emails?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey We’ll see what happens. But I do think that Digest View, like the example they used was, here’s
⏹️ ▶️ Casey all the emails about an upcoming set of flights, for example. I’m here for that.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So I was very happy for Underscore when we saw messages via satellite.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And then I got very sad for Underscore because then just a moment later, they decided
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to announce new topographic maps. In maps, you can access them offline. There’s turn-by-turn voice guidance.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I think they specifically were talking about for hikes.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco Yep, they were. This
⏹️ ▶️ Marco was literally the only new features for maps this year were targeted.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it was just targeting pedometer plus plus.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey He, because Underscore is the nicest human that’s ever lived, he was so positive and so upbeat about it.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey But my heart breaks for
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John poor Underscore. And
⏹️ ▶️ John there are other hiking apps We just have to know someone who makes one of them. And to be clear, this is
⏹️ ▶️ John exactly, you would expect Apple to add this feature. It is a logical feature to add to Maps. They should
⏹️ ▶️ John add it. Third parties have been filling this gap. Now Apple is stepping up. And I think Ernest Groh is right, that Apple is going to do what
⏹️ ▶️ John they do. But third parties are able to do more sophisticated, complicated things with different decisions.
⏹️ ▶️ John So it’s not like when Apple enters one of these areas, it makes it impossible. Like, Apple made a podcast app, and Overcast still exists.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco So it is. It didn’t actually exist at first.
⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah. It is dynamic that as a developer for any platform, you should become accustomed to
⏹️ ▶️ John and don’t be afraid that it’s going to destroy your app. Because if your app was successful
⏹️ ▶️ John at all, there’s room to make something different than what Apple does. And Apple
⏹️ ▶️ John almost never do what a third party would want to do with a given app.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Well, in all fairness, though, when Apple really does damage by a Sherlocking, it’s usually
⏹️ ▶️ Marco because they do something in a way that someone else can’t match. Like in using some kind of system integration
⏹️ ▶️ Marco or APIs that we aren’t allowed to use or business terms that we aren’t allowed to use. 30% shenanigans. That’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco what usually really kills something else.
⏹️ ▶️ John Or they massively subsidize it. Because obviously Apple can make apps that are subsidized by their bazillions of dollars from their other businesses
⏹️ ▶️ John and they can put you out of business. But they tend not to do that. They have surprisingly small teams on many of their apps.
⏹️ ▶️ John But the real thing that keeps it back is because Apple is never going to add really complicated, sophisticated features. They’re just
⏹️ ▶️ John allergic to it. Right? Yeah. And so if you know whatever obscure feature that you think
⏹️ ▶️ John hikers want, Apple’s probably never going to get around to that. They’re just going to give like the thing that works for 90% of hikers
⏹️ ▶️ John and that 10% would still be using your app. So you just have to make sure your app I mean it probably already
⏹️ ▶️ John does does something opinionated specific that is too too nitty gritty for
⏹️ ▶️ John Apple to ever add because they have to make something that works for most people and you can make something that works for like the hiking enthusiasts.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco By the way, real time follow up. Apparently the standard exists for email corporate logo headers. It’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco called BME or BIMI. And apparently, it’s not very good. But that is a public standard. So please don’t email us. Thank
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Wow. I today I learned
⏹️ ▶️ Marco somehow we missed it.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Wallet gets tapped to Apple Pay Cash. So what the theory is, you know,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey let’s say you want to pay somebody for something, but you don’t necessarily want to give out your phone
⏹️ ▶️ Casey number or your email address, what have you, then you can just tap your phones like you can to exchange stuff
⏹️ ▶️ Casey via AirDrop. So that’s pretty cool.
⏹️ ▶️ John That’s super cool. It’s like, not just that you don’t have to share it with them. Even with people who I don’t care about
⏹️ ▶️ John sharing it. Like, I’ll totally give you my. You have to do the thing of like, what’s your iMessage?
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco What’s your? I mean,
⏹️ ▶️ John that’s why Venmo and stuff have the little QR codes for you to
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey scan. Yeah, that’s true.
⏹️ ▶️ John The hassle of having to type something in or whatever. And so this is a double whammy. You don’t type anything in,
⏹️ ▶️ John and presumably, it’s privacy preserving, where you literally don’t need to give it to them.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah. You can use Apple Pay online. I guess it’s Apple Pay Cash
⏹️ ▶️ John online? Is that what they have? I missed that part of the-
⏹️ ▶️ Marco some kind of like enhancements to what you can do with Apple Pay Checkout Online. And it was various like financial,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you know, little tricks that we don’t really care
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey about. Yeah, and
⏹️ ▶️ Casey this is another example of them flying by, but they made mention of something about in the Wallet app.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So if you have like a concert ticket, there would be an event guide for that particular venue, which
⏹️ ▶️ Casey in theory sounds really great. They talked about Journal app. Honestly, I don’t really care. We should probably move on.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco they added a few. They added search, which
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey it somehow magically
⏹️ ▶️ Marco did not have, like amazingly. Now it has it. You can log your state of mind also, which
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think I’m kind of surprised it wasn’t there at first. But it’s good to see them, you know, doing something to the journal app
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like this is a brand new app that launched in a very minimal state. I didn’t have a chance. I didn’t see yet, though.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Were there any changes to journal API’s like was there any any way for, for instance, other third party
⏹️ ▶️ Marco apps to vend activities to suggest for journal
⏹️ ▶️ John to use? They didn’t mention it in the keynote, but that doesn’t mean it’s It’s not there. We’ll find out. Yeah. Indeed.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Then there’s game mode in iPhone. So that’s basically cranking everything else
⏹️ ▶️ Casey back so that the game process is the priority. Photos gets its biggest
⏹️ ▶️ Casey redesign ever. It’s got a two-pane design, which I didn’t think aesthetically
⏹️ ▶️ Casey looked great. But I can understand how they landed there because it seems like functionally it’ll be an improvement.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey There’s filters. So one of the examples they enumerated was filtering out screenshots, which is pretty cool.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Granted, I was sitting with a bunch of journalists, so they were very
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John excited about that.
⏹️ ▶️ John If you don’t have a lot of screenshots in your phone that were intentionally taken, people who write about software for a living do.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey It’s built on the amazing intelligence in the Photos app, is what was stated at the time.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey There’s collections, time, people, favorite memories, trips, et cetera. You can reorder collections, you
⏹️ ▶️ Casey can pin collections.
⏹️ ▶️ John Yes, this is so, I have many albums and I wanna put stuff in like the same three albums all the time and
⏹️ ▶️ John they’re alphabetical currently.
⏹️ ▶️ John scroll scroll scroll. I went past that letter go back up. This is great.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yep. Yeah, I think this is actually good like I obviously this is like a high risk thing to redesign the photos
⏹️ ▶️ Marco app. I will have to see like what it actually is like in use, but it I’m pretty optimistic. The
⏹️ ▶️ Marco current photos app really has a hard time scaling to very large collections, which we all slowly
⏹️ ▶️ Marco accumulate. This seems like they’ve done a lot to try to make them more manageable.
⏹️ ▶️ John mention that they and the part of the State of Union that we saw that they had redone some of the photos app in SwiftUI,
⏹️ ▶️ John but not they made a point of saying, but not the collection view, because they were showing how it could integrate
⏹️ ▶️ John with UIKit. And I think that’s because SwiftUI can’t handle the collection
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco view in photos when you have a lot of photos. Yeah, that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco would not be something I would use SwiftUI for. Right.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey They also said there’s a carousel that has a new set of photos each day, which is exciting. And then
⏹️ ▶️ Casey on the Bento box at the end, they mentioned RCS. And we all laughed, because we thought that
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that was all we were going to get with regard to RCS. But then they actually briefly said, verbally, that RCS is coming.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And also something that I think is exciting, especially for those with not as great vision, is larger
⏹️ ▶️ Casey icons on the home screen. I think that was very briefly mentioned
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John verbally. Did they show
⏹️ ▶️ John that? Because I would love to make some icons bigger and some icons smaller. You know what
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey I mean? Like is my thing
⏹️ ▶️ John with game controllers. Not every button is equally important. The primary action button on a controller is more important than
⏹️ ▶️ John the tertiary button, right? So I would love to make apps bigger. But
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John I’m not sure.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Did you have other thoughts on game controllers you want to share? All right, audio and home.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I don’t know too much that we need to say about this. I did like the AirPods Pro,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey maybe only the AirPods Pro, one way or another, you can nod or shake your head to interact with Siri. So, you know, an example
⏹️ ▶️ Casey they gave is, you know, Marco was calling, do you want to answer? And you can shake your head laterally left and right.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Siri will interpret that as no, I do not want to answer. Which is cool. Voice isolation, which we got
⏹️ ▶️ Casey an email about this actually. And I don’t know, do you remember, I feel like voice isolation was a thing in
⏹️ ▶️ John They’ve talked about it on the phone and various other things. I don’t know why maybe they did it better or
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco it seems like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco there’s like a new like ML based because there are there’s lots of new techniques out in the industry for ML based
⏹️ ▶️ Marco voice installation. I got I remember in video did this amazing demo showing it off like two years ago
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and and other products have added it here and there. So I you’re right. They have had like various
⏹️ ▶️ Marco techniques for various noise cancelling and microphone isolation techniques over time. I think
⏹️ ▶️ Marco those have mostly just been very kind of simple hardware tricks and this seems seems like it’s more ML based. Yeah, so
⏹️ ▶️ Marco this should work a lot better and be more advanced. It’s gonna be pretty cool if it works.
⏹️ ▶️ John I hope it’s not AirPods Pro only. They just showed the AirPods Pro.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco voice isolation is they said AirPods Pro. They specifically said
⏹️ ▶️ Marco nodding your head might be for both, but sorry, John, you’re gonna have to get on the pro train eventually. Yep,
⏹️ ▶️ John This was fun for you, huh? This time, remember the big cup talking gave about how third party apps are still liable. Apple does something
⏹️ ▶️ Marco something there was a feature at its TV OS called insight. Now I believe it was
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like something else. I’ve seen what
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John oh yeah, Amazon X ray.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey Yes, that’s right
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and what else there was some other app.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John Oh yeah, your app that’s right
⏹️ ▶️ John before Casey decided to make call sheet. We’ve been saying for years that x ray is a great feature that Amazon has and people
⏹️ ▶️ John always have a question when they’re watching a show. What is that person from an x ray provides that feature x rays interface to be clear is
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco like every Amazon interface.
⏹️ ▶️ John He’s app call sheet in case you don’t know is the thing where you can look up what people have been in movies and tv shows and so on and so forth and
⏹️ ▶️ John it’s a very nice app. The thing I would say to may encourage you here is those on screen things
⏹️ ▶️ John for doing that. I think they should be there and they’re great, but Apple’s history of making an interface on the
⏹️ ▶️ John TV itself that lets you do anything sensible is not good. I would much rather
⏹️ ▶️ John look when someone says what is that person from?
⏹️ ▶️ John I threw an interface on the screen while we were watching the show, she doesn’t want me to even pause it.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco She wants me to
⏹️ ▶️ John look it up on my phone, in which case I’ll use call sheet and again I’m not pooping this feature. I think it should exist. I
⏹️ ▶️ John think it’s great. Hopefully
⏹️ ▶️ John a better interface than X ray, but there is is still definitely a place for a thing for app that use on your
⏹️ ▶️ John phone to look up who that person is without pausing the show and without putting anything on the screen. Yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco well, and also the you know the the the new feature will only were inside is gone. It will only
⏹️ ▶️ Marco work on apple tv app like it won’t work in
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey third party. I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John thought it was just in the
⏹️ ▶️ John apple tv player, but
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey again, exactly
⏹️ ▶️ John hindsight, it does make some
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco right. They wouldn’t have the data right right. They just
⏹️ ▶️ John they just do screen like do the shazam version video shazam.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco they’re definitely not doing that. I
⏹️ ▶️ John know, but like that. That would be the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco doing that to show you
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John ads, you know, but apple’s not doing that
⏹️ ▶️ John technology does exist, but apple is not you. This is just for apple tv plus television shows or
⏹️ ▶️ Marco but if I use that instead of call sheet, I’d be spoiled constantly on you know character reveals and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey that’s true. That’s a
⏹️ ▶️ Casey yeah. I apparently owe you a drink at dinner
⏹️ ▶️ Casey but no, it was funny, though, because for
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco I think I owe you some
⏹️ ▶️ Casey for a hot second, I was devastated because I was I thought it was for everything
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and I think part of the reason I thought that which in retrospect was silly, but I knew that there was so much AI
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and ML and what have you, and I’m like envisioning this world where they’re like figuring out what’s on screen. I mean,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey could. Hypothetically, they could, but the more I think about it, the more I think that that’s challenging,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey at least today, maybe in the future it won’t be, but today I think that’s really challenging.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco It makes more sense. I don’t
⏹️ ▶️ Marco think it’s challenging, I
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John And it’s privacy invasive
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey in a way that Apple doesn’t
⏹️ ▶️ Casey so there was a five minute window before people started reporting in and sending me texts that
⏹️ ▶️ Casey no, no, no, no, no, it’s okay, it’s just Apple TV Plus. And then I was not quite so miserable, but
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John for a second. It’s all
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey experience. Well,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that’s the thing is
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John underscore again, underscore sitting
⏹️ ▶️ Casey right behind me. And he’s like, nope, this is part of the process. So anyways, but yes, it was funny in
⏹️ ▶️ Casey retrospect, not funny at the time. Enhanced dialogue. One of my favorite features about my beloved
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Sonos setup is that the soundbars, or at least my soundbar, can
⏹️ ▶️ Casey do their own dialogue enhancing mode,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey not flawless, but it works reasonably well. And I am old enough now
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that I feel like generally speaking I can hear, but particularly at nighttime when the kids are asleep and Declan’s room is right above
⏹️ ▶️ Casey our family room where we watch TV, I don’t wanna have to crank the volume in order to just understand what the heck
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John are saying. Do
⏹️ ▶️ John you have reduced loud sounds on?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I don’t, I understand the question. I don’t recall. You should try that.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’ll have to give that a shot. You’re talking about
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John the reduced loud
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey sound? Just a compressor. Yeah, I leave that
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I should give that a shot, but one way or another, there’s now enhanced dialogue for I think any playback on Apple TV,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey which I’m really excited for, because presumably an Apple TV box is going to have more processing power than my ARC
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John soundbar. So these
⏹️ ▶️ John enhanced dial-up features exist everywhere. They’re on every TV, they’re on every receiver, they’re on every set dial box. It’s good that Apple
⏹️ ▶️ John has one, but I have to tell you the quality of these varies widely. So
⏹️ ▶️ John Apple does a good job of it because it’s easy to just like, oh, I’m just applying an EQ curve and human voices
⏹️ ▶️ John are around here and that is awful. And that’s been around for ages and there’s increasing amounts of ML or whatever. So
⏹️ ▶️ John I hope Apple has done a good job of this because it actually is pretty hard to do because if you listen to a bad one, it’s
⏹️ ▶️ John it’s grading on your ears like you can like the voices are just too loud and to clear and
⏹️ ▶️ John everything else feels in the distance. So doing this well is actually kind of tricky and I’m looking forward to seeing apples implementation.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I mean it could literally be the exact same algorithms as the voice isolation for air pods pro just like tuned
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John down you know like with less reduction of background, but you
⏹️ ▶️ John do have to be careful because you don’t want it to sound like like the people are like
⏹️ ▶️ John right in front of your face and the whole rest of the show is back there.
⏹️ ▶️ John can you can over enhance it.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco mean, one thing that Apple is historically very good at is doing features like this with subtlety.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Like a lot of times they get criticized for not like doing a more extreme version or having more controls over how they’re doing things like this.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco But I would trust them to do this well enough that it would be, if anything, people, you would say
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it doesn’t go far enough. It’s probably going to be a pretty subtle effect. Like the demo, I mean, obviously we were hearing it
⏹️ ▶️ Marco over like concert speakers, so who knows how it sounds in person, but the demo of it seemed like it was actually
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Auto subtitle appearance when muting or skipping back. I thought that they already did this for like, what did she say
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John or whatever.
⏹️ ▶️ John They do it when you ask the Siri remote, what did they say? And then it will go backwards three seconds,
⏹️ ▶️ John turn subtitles on, play through, and then turn the subtitles back off, which is one of the best features of Apple TV. And
⏹️ ▶️ John now this is even more of that of saying, look, if you just skipped back, you don’t even have to, because it is
⏹️ ▶️ John kind of annoying to pick up the remote and mumble into it, what did they say or whatever. This,
⏹️ ▶️ John if you skip back, it just assumes it’s because you didn’t hear something. So that removes a step and that’s great. And the
⏹️ ▶️ John auto subtitling appearance when muting is a no brainer that is great.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, I love that. Support for, I think it was 21 by nine projectors, whatever the standard
⏹️ ▶️ Casey aspect ratio is, which is kind of interesting and cool. I don’t know anyone that uses an Apple TV with a projector,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey but I know what happens, so that’s neat. And then different screen savers are gonna be available, slideshows, portraits,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey moments from Apple TV plus shows. And then they did a big song and dance about Snoopy and how
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that’s gonna be a screensaver, so that’s cool.
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WWDC
⏹️ ▶️ Casey WatchOS. They talked a lot about activity or activeness.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I know that’s not really a word but
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco anyway. That’s it, yeah. Activation.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Activation, that’s what it was. But they talked about training load, which was interesting. To be honest, I was slightly
⏹️ ▶️ Casey tuned out at this point because I was still figuring out if my job was going away.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco You were sending your emails. Right,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey exactly. No, but they talked about training load and, you know, oh, if you’ve trained really, really hard
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that, you know, maybe you need to back it off a little bit so you don’t get exhausted, et cetera, et cetera. You can customize the summary
⏹️ ▶️ Casey tab in fitness, which I’m excited about. You can also have different goals for different days. You can account
⏹️ ▶️ Casey for injuries. And gentlemen, you can pause for rest days.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John This is great. You know there’s someone out
⏹️ ▶️ John there who got a Series Zero watch, and they’ve been on a streak, and they’ve been getting the badges, and they haven’t
⏹️ ▶️ John missed a single day. And now finally, that person can have one day of rest.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I don’t think a Series Zero watch would have enough battery
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John life to give you your standout. they’ve been
⏹️ ▶️ John going from watch to watch and somehow haven’t lost all their streaks.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey Oh yeah, they just they’ve just
⏹️ ▶️ John because we saying this for years like they they motive they gamified this by giving you cool little badges for going
⏹️ ▶️ John on streaks, but it’s unhealthy to like for example, keep doing the same activity through injuries
⏹️ ▶️ John or never to take a day off and we’re always been like apple like this is you’re not promoting a healthy lifestyle. The
⏹️ ▶️ John people who are most addicted to this gamified thing are going to end up injuring themselves and
⏹️ ▶️ John making their lives worse. Let people have a day off pause for a day. The
⏹️ ▶️ John streak still counts. This is just a life lesson that apple is now learned and now is passing on to
⏹️ ▶️ John us. It’s okay to take a day off and if you’re injured, don’t do the same activity you normally do and now
⏹️ ▶️ John the watch understands that and allow you to maintain your streak and I think it is completely legitimate
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and also like there’s there’s this like falling off the wagon effect where like if you have had a long streak
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and then you have to break it, you’re forced to break it for some reason. A lot of times it’s really hard to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey ever go back and you like well it’s over now yeah and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John I don’t have my ever go back
⏹️ ▶️ Marco yeah exactly like you well. I’m off the wagon now forget. I guess I’ll go back to you know being a slob like it
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and it’s so it can be very motivating. So actually like enabling rest days, not only
⏹️ ▶️ Marco is is you know healthier mentally for the people who are trying to keep streets going, but I think it will result in people keeping
⏹️ ▶️ Marco more streaks overall and and like and not falling off that that wagon as much because
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it is not it. You don’t you’re not like losing. Oh there it is. I’m gone forever like I lost all this that I’ve worked for
⏹️ ▶️ Marco might as well throw it away,
⏹️ ▶️ John but it makes Apple watch stickier or not, you know, for
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey self motivated thing where like you’re,
⏹️ ▶️ John you’re not going to switch to a different watch if you still have your streaks going.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Indeed. Uh, they talked a little bit about a vitals app, which I’m genuinely excited
⏹️ ▶️ Casey about, uh, to see kind of like an, an overall status of what your health is across
⏹️ ▶️ Casey several different metrics, which is cool. Cause fit fitness obviously is specifically about exercise and things
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of that nature and fitness and vitals is more of a holistic view of everything about you. I
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I like what they’re doing here. So, the idea is daily health metrics, overall health status. If
⏹️ ▶️ Marco something changes in a few different ways, like if your vitals in different ways change, they will
⏹️ ▶️ Marco alert you like, hey, your heart rate’s been up this week, and also other stuff has changed. That’s nice,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco but why? I have to wonder, why can’t this just be the health app? I feel
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like the health app, honestly, is a mess. There’s so much in there, and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I don’t think the health app does a good job
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John of information
⏹️ ▶️ John You mean on the watch? Because this is the watchOS section. You mean in general, the health app.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I mean in general.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John I think this should
⏹️ ▶️ Marco be just a function of the
⏹️ ▶️ John Maybe it is. Maybe this is just the vitals tab in the health app now.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco No, well, maybe. I mean, I thought it was a whole separate app. I thought it
⏹️ ▶️ Casey was a whole separate app. I’m pretty sure it is. And I will concur. I don’t want to belabor it.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco is saying it’s in the health app on iOS and on watchOS it’s separate. So maybe it’s just a
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John separate screen.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John interesting.
⏹️ ▶️ John That’s what I assumed.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey way, the health app, from an information architecture perspective, the health app is
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco disaster. It’s just terrible.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Like Apple’s modern design language that they use there of just like a bunch, like a grid of
⏹️ ▶️ Marco square, a round rectal squares with like some text in the corner and that’s it. And there’s just a huge
⏹️ ▶️ Marco grid. Like I feel like that is, that does not scale to a lot of information. That’s fine
⏹️ ▶️ Marco if you have a simple app like Reminders where you have like those little blocks, it’s the same pattern. Reminders, that’s okay
⏹️ ▶️ Marco there, but the health app has a thousand different things in it. And I don’t feel like it’s organized
⏹️ ▶️ Marco well. So maybe they’ll do a better job of this.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey They talked about cycle tracking and gestational age, which I thought was very cool. And a lot
⏹️ ▶️ Casey more support about pregnancy specific metrics. So as an example,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you know, I think they, I think they use blood pressure as an example, but there was something that they cited that it goes
⏹️ ▶️ Casey up quite a bit during pregnancy and that’s normally okay, but you want to keep an eye on it, et cetera, et cetera. So I thought
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that was really cool.
⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah, that’s another example of third-party app opportunity type thing. Even more so here, because the health data
⏹️ ▶️ John is essentially a shared database that other apps can access and do things with. And there are tons
⏹️ ▶️ John of pregnancy tracking apps on the App Store right now. And it’s like, oh, Apple is now
⏹️ ▶️ John going to give you one for free, so why would anyone use a third-party one? I hope the third-party ones could integrate with
⏹️ ▶️ John the new pregnancy-specific information that is presumably in the health database to enhance themselves. And of course, those
⏹️ ▶️ John apps are going to be way more sophisticated, way more varied, way more tailored to people’s individual goals or whatever.
⏹️ ▶️ John So I think this would actually be a boost to that market, not a detriment to it.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Well, honestly, maybe it might have to be a detriment. Because a lot of times, remember, it came out a few years
⏹️ ▶️ Marco ago that the privacy of those apps is horrendous. All the leading pregnancy tracking
⏹️ ▶️ Marco apps that somebody could find a couple years ago, they were all sending that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey data to Facebook. Oh, that’s
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John yeah. I feel
⏹️ ▶️ John like that. That is true. And I feel like the competitive landscape
⏹️ ▶️ John should change so that now there is a privacy-preserving option, So maybe apps have to do that less.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, I think that anytime Apple can add this kind of like, even though their version is going to be more
⏹️ ▶️ Marco basic, more just core functionality, they’re going to get the 20% solution.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco But even like that is usually a good thing if the alternative is a market full
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of privacy invading awful apps. Yeah, I just want
⏹️ ▶️ John to sell your name to diaper manufacturing and get some new ads for diaper. It makes perfect
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey sense. That’s how they do
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it. Connections was another section where they talked about several different things. they will automatically add new widgets
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to the SmartStack watch face, which is kind of sort of the nouveau Siri watch face. There’s translate
⏹️ ▶️ Casey in the Apple Watch that uses quote, machine learning models to do the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco translation.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Live activities in the SmartStack. I don’t use live activities enough, but if there’s
⏹️ ▶️ Casey anything that’s gonna get me on this watch face, it’s live activities in SmartStack. I am here for that, very excited
⏹️ ▶️ Casey about it. And in fact, I’m jumping ahead a bit, but there seem to be a lot of different
⏹️ ▶️ Casey things where they’re acknowledging and embracing the fact that the iPhone is kind of the core computing
⏹️ ▶️ Casey device of your life,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey for the three of us, where I think we’re all primarily Mac people, but, and John will argue
⏹️ ▶️ Casey with me as soon as I stop talking, but generally speaking, I think for a lot of people, the iPhone is the prime,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey or maybe not primary, but the most important hub of your digital life. And I think a lot
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of things are now, Apple’s embracing that for a lot of features, and this is one of them, live
⏹️ ▶️ Casey activities on the SmartStack. So, you know, we’re getting Lyfts and Ubers and whatnot while we’re here in San Jose
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and Cupertino. And so having that appear on your watch, whatever the live activity is
⏹️ ▶️ Casey on your watch, that’s exciting. So I’m looking forward to that.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, and that is a theme throughout. I think that’s a good, you know, what we have with
⏹️ ▶️ Marco our iPhones is it’s always the primary, it’s always where things come first. It’s always the device
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that like, no matter what is going on, if you’re traveling or something, you’re always gonna at least have your phone. Like it makes
⏹️ ▶️ Marco a lot of sense to keep the iPhone as the center of everything and to bring those features
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to the other platforms when you can, but still having the, cause like, that’s no matter what Apple tries to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco do, the iPhone’s always gonna be the primary computer device. So as much as they can embrace that and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco make the iPhone help the other platforms, as much as they can do that, it’s better.
⏹️ ▶️ John And we’ll see the iPhone helping the other platforms by making appearance on them. Yes.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Can I just say my favorite addition to watchOS, the double tap API.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So tell me more, I’m not trying to be funny, tell me more about why that’s so exciting for you. Because I don’t have double tap, so I don’t know
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John out on. But-
⏹️ ▶️ John You couldn’t, remember you couldn’t do it before, only Apple had access to it.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey like it, do you use the feature in Apple stuff at all ever or no?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco No, because it’s very slow and unreliable. Cool. So like I try to use it to like dismiss notifications
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey or whatever,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I have found it to be way too slow. And you know, I have the Series 9, like I have the right hardware
⏹️ ▶️ Marco for it, and it’s just really unreliable. And when it does work,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it’s much slower than doing it yourself, because you have to give it a second to recognize it.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And then it taps you to tell you, hey, I recognize this. And it shows a little overlay saying,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco double tap. But the reason I want it is that my customers want to use it. And I’ve gotten
⏹️ ▶️ Marco so many emails from people since it launched saying, hey, double tap doesn’t work in your app. What the heck,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco man? Because they don’t know that until this, the only thing third-party apps could do with it was
⏹️ ▶️ Marco use it dismiss notifications
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the primary action on a notification. That’s all it could do. So absolutely and and of course, what
⏹️ ▶️ Marco they expect from overtap is play pause like that when you when
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John you of course, that would be what
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey it does right. So it makes sense and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it just seemed like I was being neglectful by not having this in my app when really I couldn’t have it in my app. So now that’s going
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to be good for you know for the very basic thing and you know whatever they add in the future in this area. If
⏹️ ▶️ Marco they add more gestures or more things like that, hopefully they would they will now add these switch who have modifiers for them as well.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep. Photos watch face gets better customization and will automatically find photos. I don’t know what
⏹️ ▶️ Casey specifically that means. I mean, I understand those
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco words. It meant machine learning. That’s what
⏹️ ▶️ Marco they said. They still, so this is, now we’re like, you know, a half hour and they still didn’t say AI once.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep. All right. iPadOS 18, yes? Or are we
⏹️ ▶️ Casey taking another pause?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco We don’t need more pauses. Okay, sorry. Paused out.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey We are paused out, okay. iPadOS 18. I would like to make an opening statement about this.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Everyone was waiting for Apple to say, don’t worry you guys, we’ve solved
⏹️ ▶️ John Like I said, there was no rumors about
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey that. No, there were no rumors, but
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John this morning. No expectations.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I think it was just this morning, and I apologize, I am not even going to be doing show notes
⏹️ ▶️ Casey for this episode, so the show notes are barren. But there was a Verge link that I’m not going to look up, but you can look
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it up yourselves. There’s a Verge link where they talked about basically, I feel like it was literally this morning, like, hey,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey we’ve got this incredible hardware, Where’s the software? And so all of us, I agree,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey John, that nobody was necessarily expecting it, but we were all hoping for it and it didn’t land. And
⏹️ ▶️ Casey what did land though, was actually for me to this point, the most impressive
⏹️ ▶️ Casey stuff I saw in the entire keynote. Like I was excited about other things for sure, but
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the iPad demo, iPadOS demo, blew my mind more than
⏹️ ▶️ Casey anything else I think I saw during the keynote. So what did we talk about?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Well, first it has the home screen customization from iOS 18, which honestly, that’s new.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John Yeah, it’s not a
⏹️ ▶️ John given that it’s gonna
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco get new features.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Right, usually when something cool comes to the, comes to like springboard in iOS, the home screen, the widgets,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco usually that either doesn’t come to the iPad at all that year and maybe comes like the following year, or it comes to the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco iPad in a much more limited way. In this case, all of that home screen customization and stuff that is in iOS 18 is
⏹️ ▶️ Marco also all on iPad OS 18. So that was actually a pleasant surprise. Yep, couldn’t agree more.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So there’s that. The same story with Control Center
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and a lot of the photos stuff. They talked a lot about a floating tab bar, which I believe
⏹️ ▶️ Casey they either said or implied has an associated API where-
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco Yes, it does.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey This is like on the Apple TV Plus app where there’s a tab bar at the top. And that was, I was like, okay, fine, whatever.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And then they said, oh, and there’s some, I don’t know if it’s like a hamburger button or whatever, but there’s some button you can press
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and then that tab bar will slide down into the, I was gonna say the left, but wherever your text starts-
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco Into a sidebar. Leading- It’ll
⏹️ ▶️ Marco slide out into dot leading.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey Into dot leading,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey right? Into a sidebar. And that, I thought, was extremely cool.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And so they talked about, they made a big stink, a happy stink, about how there’s improved
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and refined animations. They talked a little bit about share play. And at this point, I started
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to pass out. But then they started talking about screen sharing. And I woke back up. And they said,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey there are a couple of very interesting features. You can tap and draw on the screen to instruct the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey remote users. So they showed like putting a gigantic like F you who like it’s
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco right here. It’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey right here circle button in big hot
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it’s right here. Click this.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, it’s anyway, like a big arrow or circle or what have you and they also said that you can you
⏹️ ▶️ Casey can ask the remote person can ask for remote control. So if you have like grandma or grandpa
⏹️ ▶️ Casey or what have you and they don’t understand what’s going on, but they live, you know, 500 miles away you get on
⏹️ ▶️ Casey a share play call. I’m not clear how you do the screen sharing. It doesn’t really matter. but one way or another, you can say
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to grandma, I would like the control, please, and you can actually perform the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey operation that grandma or grandpa is trying to perform, which I was very excited.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco Oh, man, for remote support. Yeah, this
⏹️ ▶️ Marco this this would back when I had needs like that with my grandparents,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco would have been a godsend. This I’m very, I’m very happy
⏹️ ▶️ Marco for everybody who has to use this feature like this is going to be a big quality of life improvement.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep. We then the Sherlocking continues.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Poor James Thompson. I love James so much. Calculator is arriving on iPad.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I genuinely double down on what you guys were saying earlier
⏹️ ▶️ Casey how this doesn’t necessarily hurt James, but it’s not a fun feeling. And it’s not, I don’t
⏹️ ▶️ Casey know if it would help him necessarily. I mean, it does draw attention to
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco our calculator. I mean,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think pCalc is going to be fine because is there. Peacock has, with the sole exception of the iPad,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco has always run on platforms that had built in calculators. Well, I guess I guess the Apple TV,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco but like there were always Apple calculator apps on these platforms and Peacock still had quite a market.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I will say also when they announced calculator for iPad at the as of yet that got
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the biggest applause in the event like bigger. I would have expected emoji responses in my
⏹️ ▶️ Marco message to be a bigger applause, but no calculator for ipad by far the biggest
⏹️ ▶️ Marco applause in that keynote to up to this
⏹️ ▶️ John is interesting with casey being excited about the ipad stuff we’re about to see in a second. It’s kind of just because of the
⏹️ ▶️ John order because as we’ll see this this thing that was presented as a feature of calculator is not
⏹️ ▶️ John a feature of calculator. It is like an os wide service that appears in other os is another place like it’s
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco everywhere to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco which I think it’s just calculator and note right,
⏹️ ▶️ John but it’s clear that it’s not a feature of the calculator app of notes is using it
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco right. So what’s It’s interesting work
⏹️ ▶️ Marco yeah, so so what’s it so what we’re going to talk about now is math notes like this is so calculator you know it’s got it’s calculator
⏹️ ▶️ Marco for the iPad, but then it has this other mode called math notes that is totally unrelated.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John It might as well been a separate app like that’s a thing
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like it and so there’s with all these apps now that are or all these features now that are kind of buried
⏹️ ▶️ Marco in apple apps in weird places.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John So for instance that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John calculator there’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like the document scanning
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John that’s just built into
⏹️ ▶️ Marco on the Mac like and it has There’s a whole document scanner you can use with with phone cameras and stuff and it’s it’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco tucked into weird places like you don’t even know it’s there. Notes is the king of this. There are so
⏹️ ▶️ Marco many amazing features in Apple notes that you wouldn’t really expect to be in a notes
⏹️ ▶️ Marco app and it doesn’t really have that much to do with notes necessarily and and so this is one of them.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So this math notes feature this is what they what they demoed with which I agree case. I think this is one of the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco most impressive demos of the day math notes. it’s kind of like a combination
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of calculator and solver with handwriting
⏹️ ▶️ Marco most amazing. It’s like a handwritten solver.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John Yeah, yeah, yeah. That’s good. The most
⏹️ ▶️ Marco amazing recognition and ways to play with numbers. So the way it works is to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco use the apple pencil and you can just you can like doodle up a note or whatever and any
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you know, if you write like seven plus four equals, it will recognize that as a mathematical expression
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and stick the answer there. Well, but, but there, wait,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey there’s more. And there’s so much more. But wait, there’s
⏹️ ▶️ Casey more. Not only does it stick the answer there, the naive way of building this is
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it puts like, you know, a monospaced font. You know, what did you say? Seven times four is 28 or what have you. It doesn’t
⏹️ ▶️ Casey matter. It puts a 28 there and like a monospaced font, right? Oh no, baby. It’s going to try to mimic
⏹️ ▶️ Casey your own flippant handwriting. How amazing is that? I don’t understand how this is
⏹️ ▶️ John I don’t know if this was part of the same thing, but I think it also improve yet. It improves your handwriting
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco as well. So when you’re
⏹️ ▶️ John scribbling the numbers, it’s trying to oh you made the like the the the circle on that nine is a little bit squished.
⏹️ ▶️ John It opens it back up for you, so it’s more legible to yourself later and that’s and then it writes the answer and then
⏹️ ▶️ John like solver, which is a great app that we should link in the show instead of case he’s not making that will
⏹️ ▶️ John that will like it’s a it’s a live thing. It’s like a spreadsheet where the answer is based on the things that are before it.
⏹️ ▶️ John One of the really cool things I think I saw in the keynote was hard to tell because it was far away is what
⏹️ ▶️ John they were like. Oh, you can change the numbers and like oh changing numbers. Is it going to make me get an eraser tool and then
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco out the you can
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the presenter did that that was one of the choices, but no,
⏹️ ▶️ John but I think I think there’s like a gesture to sort of just swipe over the nine and the whole not it knows
⏹️ ▶️ John where the nine is yeah and the whole nine disappears and you type a new number in its place like and there’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco a little slight. If you hover over it,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John yeah, it shows a little
⏹️ ▶️ Marco slider above it and you can just slide the value
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John up and down yeah and so
⏹️ ▶️ John it And it does more complicated math, so more ways for kids to cheat on their homework. Not that they need it anymore, because there’s a million
⏹️ ▶️ John web based tools that will do all this for you already. Yeah, I mean like I personally I’m not a handwriting person.
⏹️ ▶️ John That’s why I like computers, but tons of tons
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco of people are
⏹️ ▶️ John like it. You know, I like silver. I like typing actual numbers. I don’t want to see my handwriting. I don’t want to hand write math
⏹️ ▶️ John equations, but sometimes, especially if you don’t know like math ML or how to like make the big
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco if you’re in
⏹️ ▶️ John like an actual math class, we have big giant expressions with fractions and and exponents and lots of parentheses
⏹️ ▶️ John and square roots over a whole big things like, you know, doing algebra. This this looks like a great
⏹️ ▶️ John teaching tool on this. You know, it’s it’s essentially, you know, I don’t know if it’s a public framework, but it’s a private framework that’s
⏹️ ▶️ John used by two of apples apps, and it’s so amazing. They should just spread it everywhere like like pencil kit. I hope they eventually
⏹️ ▶️ John will make this a third party thing that you can just pop up because it’s just what a great app. What a mat and for
⏹️ ▶️ John the iPad like it’s their one app platform that has a pencil. This is like what can you do with the pencil?
⏹️ ▶️ John They’re really cranking up the features that and we’ll see more later that appear with the pencil in pencil kit
⏹️ ▶️ John or with pencil related things in the OS.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, because this this feeds right into smart script. Actually, this was math notes and smart scripts seem to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco be the same system, you know, just so between you know, calculator has math notes notes
⏹️ ▶️ Marco also has math notes, but notes takes it further. The idea of smart scripts. This is basically the engine
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that recreates your handwriting as like a font, basically dynamically
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and so not so as you hand write notes, it figures out what your handwriting looks like as john mentions
⏹️ ▶️ Marco if you like kind of squish a letter or flub a letter it will correct it to make it more readable as you go
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and because what it’s doing is converting your handwriting into reflowable text so yeah
⏹️ ▶️ Marco after you’ve handwritten a whole page of notes with the apple pencil in in apple notes you can like delete words
⏹️ ▶️ Marco by scratching them out and then just collapses them you can copy and paste you can paste other text in and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it will paste it in in your handwriting it’s just nuts
⏹️ ▶️ John I said to the dance of next minute said so also sign checks for you yeah
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco pacing. Oh this again do
⏹️ ▶️ Marco can can people can like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John do kids still
⏹️ ▶️ Marco need doctor’s notes or like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John like notes from your parents to get out of school or
⏹️ ▶️ John all this would be great. Kids have other ways of hacking that they always do,
⏹️ ▶️ John this is definitely a cool feature and it also has kind of like shades of Newton. You know what
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey I mean like like
⏹️ ▶️ John being able to use handwriting as text and then interchangeably it’s amazing looking
⏹️ ▶️ John tech. I hope it works as well as the demos
⏹️ ▶️ Casey demoed phenomenally. If you watch nothing else in this keynote, if you ask me, watch this five
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to 10 minute demonstration. I think Jenny Chen did it. It was phenomenal. It was so cool.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey It doesn’t evaluate an expression until you draw an equal sign, which I thought was clever.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey She had a column of numbers. She was putting together a budget or something. Yeah, yeah. And
⏹️ ▶️ Casey there was a column of numbers. And she said, oh, I really wish I had a sum of this. And so she just
⏹️ ▶️ Casey underlined the bottom number. And then magically, a sum appears. It was unbelievable. She put
⏹️ ▶️ Casey a graph in one of them. She was doing like some physics
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco problem. It has a
⏹️ ▶️ Marco built in graph for because of course might as well like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey what? Why not? It was incredible. It was really yeah.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I wish I was not like john and I hand wrote things. Yeah, right.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John I just never do but again,
⏹️ ▶️ John if you don’t know like the correct note, if you ever tried to enter a complicated algebraic expression like in
⏹️ ▶️ John you know wolf from alpha or in something or whatever and you don’t know how to do that or you’re trying to use the tools, I need a big
⏹️ ▶️ John parentheses and using a tool bar. If you don’t don’t know that like the the ASCII syntax for it or whatever it’s
⏹️ ▶️ John just like just let me draw it just let me draw the expression and you know that’s it. This is
⏹️ ▶️ John really making this stuff more accessible again there there are web based tools to do this and there are teaching tools to do all these things
⏹️ ▶️ John as well and there’s wolf from alpha exists, but this is this is on your ipad. It comes with your ipad. It’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco i think this also shows like some of the kind of hilarious limits of the rumor game, because it was rumor that they would be like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco math ml support in notes yeah which like okay
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yes, like that is sort of what this is, but it’s totally missing what this really is
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So we get to Mac OS 15 Sequoia is the answer which is good because everyone
⏹️ ▶️ Casey definitely knows how to correctly pronounce and spell Sequoia, but here we are It gets
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Mac OS 15 gets all the note stuff. We just talked about Well, I guess except the pencil related things
⏹️ ▶️ John necessarily because people can use tablets.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey Oh, that’s true. I wonder if a whack
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John work. I didn’t think about that. I don’t I mean, you know, I doubt it.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey But then this is what I was alluding to earlier. They had a big section on continuity.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And I think for me, if you’re if you’re gonna watch one thing, watch math notes. If you’re gonna watch two things,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey watch this iPhone mirroring stuff. So what they said was, Hey, what? What about occasions when
⏹️ ▶️ Casey your phone is out of reach, but you want to do something with your phone. Well, what they
⏹️ ▶️ Casey they demoed was you can mirror your phone’s screen onto your Mac
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and then not only that, but you can interact with your phone using your keyboard and
⏹️ ▶️ Casey mouse, which was very freaking cool and then apparently you can pinch to zoom.
⏹️ ▶️ John I want to I mean they mentioned that I was wondering as soon as they did that. I’m like oh, it looks like a simulator right now. They’re going to make users
⏹️ ▶️ John hold down option to get the
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey and whatever
⏹️ ▶️ John I’m like there’s no way that they’re going to ask you to do that, up. And then I realized everyone has a trackpad so you can just,
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey oh, that’s true.
⏹️ ▶️ John This is your virtual phone on your Mac screen. It’s, I mean, you feel like, oh, how lazy are, why don’t you just go get your
⏹️ ▶️ John phone? But honestly, it’s, it’s a backdoor to let you run iPhone apps on your Mac essentially, because previously only
⏹️ ▶️ John iPad apps could be run on your Mac and their little windows. Now your whole freaking phone is there on your Mac. This, I think this is
⏹️ ▶️ John a great feature. It makes such a perfect integration of like, because they make the phone platform and the Mac, like,
⏹️ ▶️ John excellent. I give this two thumbs up. I mean, I don’t I don’t even know how often I’ll use it, but it just seems like something that should
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and think of so many so also notifications from the phone will show up on the Mac. The
⏹️ ▶️ Marco audio from the phone comes through the Mac. You can have standby support where like the phone can be on a
⏹️ ▶️ Marco char on a charging stand in stand by showing some widgets next to your desk and you can be using it on the Mac. Like you can drag and drop
⏹️ ▶️ Marco files to the phone from the Magley that I think this is going to be one of those things that we start to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco use all the time and not even realize
⏹️ ▶️ Casey wonder how we lived before it
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco exists, yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco even just some something simple like like what if what if you break your screen on your phone and you need to like you know
⏹️ ▶️ John extend the life of phones with broken
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco screens or just like
⏹️ ▶️ John laptop around with me
⏹️ ▶️ Marco yeah or you know get get info off of it before you get it. You had a replacement
⏹️ ▶️ John apple will start selling a headless iphone shuffle.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey I can’t even I can’t even with that.
⏹️ ▶️ John I have a stick of trident gum, but you need it. You need another device to use
⏹️ ▶️ Casey No, but I know I just I want to reiterate what Marco just said, because you went so fast, but I think it’s important. A
⏹️ ▶️ Casey notification comes through on your Mac. It looks like it is peer
⏹️ ▶️ Casey with all your Mac notifications. You can click on it on the Mac, and it will start
⏹️ ▶️ Casey up the phone mirroring, so you’ll see your phone, and then you can interact with that notification,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey because your phone has now started whatever app that notification came from, which is incredible.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And like you said a moment ago, you could have standby. I don’t personally use standby, just because I don’t really have like a
⏹️ ▶️ Casey dock that makes it easy, but I love the idea of it. But if you are a standby person, you can have your phone
⏹️ ▶️ Casey sitting next to your computer. And similar to how CarPlay eventually started
⏹️ ▶️ Casey working where it was not literally what you were doing on your phone, it became like a second screen.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Well, standby can remain up while you’re interacting
⏹️ ▶️ Casey with your phone on the computer. So your phone is doing two things concurrently. Very, very,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey very cool stuff. This is
⏹️ ▶️ John also a read just now that it needs to be reinforced or reinforcing the max dominance as the platform
⏹️ ▶️ John where you can do everything
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco You can run iPad
⏹️ ▶️ John apps. You can run Mac apps. You can use your entire phone. It integrates with all these things You can develop apps for all
⏹️ ▶️ John those platforms The only thing you can’t do is division OS stuff and that still kind of seems like it’s off in the corner
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco and the pencil So
⏹️ ▶️ John yeah, I do wonder about the pencil. Obviously you can use an iPad a sidecar I don’t think there’s any pencil support
⏹️ ▶️ John in that mode but Technically speaking, it seems like it would be plausible to allow you to use your Apple
⏹️ ▶️ John Pencil on your iPad screen when using a sidecar. We’ll see how, I mean, they should just make Touch Max with pencil support. I mean, they’ll
⏹️ ▶️ John get to it eventually, but not
⏹️ ▶️ Marco this year. And cellular and OLED.
⏹️ ▶️ John you know, get in line. OLED we’re gonna get, don’t worry about it,
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey that’s coming.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey What else do they have? Video conferencing stuff. Oh wait, window tiling, you blew right past that. Oh, I’m sorry,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you’re right, that’s true.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco This is something-
⏹️ ▶️ Marco There goes a bunch of apps that manage windows. Don’t worry, John, you’re totally safe from being Sherlocked.
⏹️ ▶️ John Well, the app doesn’t do any of this stuff. Like again, they still don’t expose enough APIs for you to do something good. I know window
⏹️ ▶️ John tiling, window tiling is one of the few things you can do because you don’t need interactive support for it. It’s like, oh, I just enter a keyboard command and the active
⏹️ ▶️ John window, but goes into the third or a quarter or whatever, but like real time interactive window dragging, like
⏹️ ▶️ John when you’re dragging a shape in like Adobe Illustrator or Affinity Designer or something, there’s no APIs
⏹️ ▶️ John for that. And Apple doesn’t do it itself. And so, but yeah, this does hurt a lot of apps that do the same thing. This is just catch up with
⏹️ ▶️ John windows. They’ve had this forever. People just expect to be able to yank a window to the side of the screen and have it tile. And now it does,
⏹️ ▶️ John and it will hurt a bunch of third party apps. But third party apps do way more than this. So again, there’s room for them to exist.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Though this is another moment where there was a lot of applause when we were sitting there.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey so funny, too, because you guys have talked about it, or maybe just Marco, I guess, has talked about in the past. They don’t have the pregnant pause,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you know, when they’re waiting for people to stop clapping because it’s a
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John recorded video. They just keep going. They just
⏹️ ▶️ Casey keep plowing forward. But there was a lot of applause for that. So like I said, there’s some video conferencing stuff.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I mean, they have Zoom-style fake
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John backgrounds. I thought they already
⏹️ ▶️ John had that, but yeah, it’s a catch-up
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco feature. system
⏹️ ▶️ Marco wide, you know, background replacement for any in any video
⏹️ ▶️ John and presumably they’ll do a less janky job of it. I mean their demo looked pristine, but we’ll see
⏹️ ▶️ John competition to see who has the best
⏹️ ▶️ Marco machine learn. Everyone’s demos always look pristine. Let’s see what happens in like when you’re in dim lighting and stuff
⏹️ ▶️ Casey It’s a real time follow up. I just adjusted where I was sitting and I definitely kicked over my capped water bottle.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So maybe John was right about this,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco because I had it.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I had it at the edge of my chair and I adjusted where I was sitting and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey levels are important.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Levels, levels. I have been, I’ve had opinions
⏹️ ▶️ Casey about where 1Password has been going for the last year or two.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And I will say that there is now a passwords app on all
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of the platforms, including Windows on the iCloud for Windows app. And I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey will be exploring that later this year. And I’m going
⏹️ ▶️ Casey That’s all I’m gonna say about that for now.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yes, I’m looking for, It is not as full-featured as 1Passport by any means. In particular,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it seems, I haven’t explored yet whether there’s any kind of group functionality like family sharing and things
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey like that. So
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco I had somebody talk to me. There
⏹️ ▶️ Casey is, there is. We have that already? Oh, so I had somebody reach out on Mastodon because I think I’d cast
⏹️ ▶️ Casey out a question about this. And I know that there is something, but I don’t know. We talked about it on the show, now you’re
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey Geez. I’m currently using it. Yes,
⏹️ ▶️ John you can make arbitrary groups where you share things in your iCloud keychain. I have two groups. I have family
⏹️ ▶️ John passwords and parent passwords. And once you put a thing into that group, it is shared with the people
⏹️ ▶️ John who you say it are just a completely arbitrary. It works great. I mean for passwords, the verification goes the whole
⏹️ ▶️ John nine yards and yeah, this app. I mean people have been asking for this because passwords like the key chain
⏹️ ▶️ John access app is obscure and weird.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco not for regular people
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John to exactly. I don’t think it’s for me and they shouldn’t really offer any but then there was
⏹️ ▶️ John the password, you know, settings thing on ios and the password preference pain slash whatever
⏹️ ▶️ John they’re called in settings, right? But it’s just kind of buried and people were making shortcuts to launch it. But now there will be dedicated apps.
⏹️ ▶️ John So it’s better. It’s more exposed. It just makes it feel more comfortable. Like, yes, when I need to get my passwords to go right now,
⏹️ ▶️ John key chain access does more than just passwords. Key chain access has secure notes. Key chain access
⏹️ ▶️ John has all your stupid developer certificates in it. That stuff isn’t exposed in passwords like that
⏹️ ▶️ John is in the key chain, so to speak. And that is important stuff. And so key chain access has to still exist. But
⏹️ ▶️ John regular people should not touch that because you can really hose yourself by like, Oh, I don’t know what these certificates are. Let me delete all these like even
⏹️ ▶️ John if you’re not a developer, don’t do that like that your root SSL certificates are represented in there. There’s your log in
⏹️ ▶️ John key chain and the system key chain and things that people don’t have to understand. Plus making what I call certificate
⏹️ ▶️ John signing requests for making SSL certificates. If you’re not using let’s encrypt what you should be
⏹️ ▶️ John like keychain access will soldier on, but since the last version of mac OS when you launch keychain access,
⏹️ ▶️ John it says hey, are you sure you want to launch keychain?
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco I say passwords
⏹️ ▶️ John Do you want me to just open the passwords preference, but and now I hope it will say actually there’s a whole other app
⏹️ ▶️ John called passwords. You should go to that one, and it’s a swift UI app, and it looks nice, and I hope it doesn’t have right align text fields
⏹️ ▶️ John for the passwords, but we’ll see how that goes.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, I think this is you know there are going to be some things you know like secure notes you mentioned are not there, but like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you know where secure notes are in notes like you can make a locked note
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John and have all this,
⏹️ ▶️ John but those aren’t in keychain. I do wonder how they’re going to square this because I do have secure like the secure notes and notes
⏹️ ▶️ John are in the notes database and encrypted The secure notes in Keychain Access, I believe, are in the keychain with all
⏹️ ▶️ John of the, in iCloud Keychain, with all the secure synced stuff. I may be wrong about that, but I think there’s
⏹️ ▶️ John two different worlds, and I wonder how they’re going to reconcile that, because that is a feature that people like 1Password, like they just want
⏹️ ▶️ John to like, here’s an arbitrary list of secure stuff that I want to be locked up or whatever. And you can
⏹️ ▶️ John do that in Keychain, but it’s a terrible interface for it. Then using it in Notes is much nicer, so I hope that’s what people are doing.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I wonder if maybe they’re just trying to keep the iCloud Keychain data size small
⏹️ ▶️ Marco lightweight. Like, you know, if you, you know, with one password, you can you can have just arbitrary files that you stick
⏹️ ▶️ Marco in there. And the way it does it is honestly kind of rough. But you know, so I’ve like scanned my driver’s license
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of it in there, for instance. Like, you know, if you put like one image or one PDF into Keychain, it’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco gonna be way larger probably than everything else in there. And that’s just for one of them. So, like, if they keep the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco size of everything small, maybe that helps them keep it fast and reliable.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey All right. They talked about Safari for a bit. They said the quote private browsing
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that’s actually private. Which I thought was
⏹️ ▶️ John didn’t go deeper into that, but we all know who they’re.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Well, yeah, and then the next line was, if you’ve missed anything we’ve added to Safari over the last few years,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it’s time to check it out. They were clearly targeting Chrome. Because look, the reality is
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Safari has a Chrome problem. Chrome is way more popular than Safari, and Google is being
⏹️ ▶️ Marco extremely aggressive at getting the most people possible to switch to it. Google is
⏹️ ▶️ Marco so, the second you sign into any Google service, that email saying, like, complete your Google setup. And it’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like hammers home, you got to install Chrome, you got to install Chrome on all your devices. Like, the fact is, Safari
⏹️ ▶️ Marco has a severe problem with like losing people to Chrome a lot over the years.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So this was clearly targeted at that. And I think it’s good to see Apple being a bit aggressive
⏹️ ▶️ Marco there because they have to be.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep, couldn’t agree more. So they highlighted quote, machine learning quotes,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey which which includes directions to things that it detects on the page, summaries of pages,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey quick links to learn more about like people, movie, music, TV shows. This was not a call sheet thing in my eyes.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey That’s just, you know, hey, there’s…
⏹️ ▶️ John It’s just basically this is all kind of Safari saying the web is junked up with crap. And
⏹️ ▶️ John we know when you land on a web page, maybe you just don’t know what the deal is with this TV show and you can’t see it through the barrage
⏹️ ▶️ John of ads and other garbage. And so there’s reader mode that’s existed for years. It will summarize it.
⏹️ ▶️ John And if there’s media stuff, it will try to extract that stuff and probably give you a button so you can see it on Apple TV+.
⏹️ ▶️ John It’s an opportunity for them to integrate with streaming services, but it’s also just a lot of Safari’s
⏹️ ▶️ John tools seem like the web is an annoying place to be sometimes.
⏹️ ▶️ John And we will try to use our application to scrape out the stuff that you actually want and present it to you
⏹️ ▶️ John in a nice way. And I appreciate that.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep. Reader includes now a table of contents and a summary, which I thought
⏹️ ▶️ Casey was very cool. in like a little sidebar area, which was neat. Then they talked about viewer,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey which was specifically for video playback. It’s unclear, like John wrote in the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey notes, does this work on YouTube, question mark? We don’t know. So it’s unclear
⏹️ ▶️ Casey what the situation is, but it has a mode where the video will take up the entire
⏹️ ▶️ Casey window area, which I really liked, because I don’t necessarily want to go full screen with the video, but I wanted to make the video take
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John window area. And it
⏹️ ▶️ John uses the native player, too. Like if you watch some webpage that has video in it, some weird video player and there’s a bunch of blinking
⏹️ ▶️ John ads in the corner and there’s some things like this will yank it out into the native player somehow.
⏹️ ▶️ John That’s why I asked if it works in YouTube, because how would that work? There’s a bunch of utilities to do that with YouTube now, and they’ll essentially
⏹️ ▶️ John modify the markup on the page to let you use the native player, turn it into an HTML five player. So
⏹️ ▶️ John that would be the first thing I try on that. But that’s, you know, it’s good to have that feature available. These features are great because if you
⏹️ ▶️ John don’t want to use them, they don’t mess with your web browsing, but it’s always worth a try. And I’ve
⏹️ ▶️ John using reader more and more often just because so many web pages are so junked up it’s impossible to actually read them.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey It’s bad. John, there was some talk about gaming. So anyway… Yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ John you know the game porting toolkit there they are not budging on this.
⏹️ ▶️ John The idea that this is a tool for you to port your games as opposed to what other people like you know
⏹️ ▶️ John Valve has done with the Steam Deck and everything of saying no no Apple will take care
⏹️ ▶️ John of this you just run your game and we will make it work on the Mac. They’re saying no, this is tool for you developer
⏹️ ▶️ John for you to make your game to run on the Mac because we want it to be essentially a native Mac game. We don’t want this to be a way to run
⏹️ ▶️ John Windows games on Mac, although it is and they mentioned they mentioned crossover and that whatever that whiskey thing
⏹️ ▶️ John is like there’s a bunch of other tools that use the game party toolkit to essentially provide an app. It’s like hey go here and you
⏹️ ▶️ John can play Windows games on your Mac and you totally can’t right but Apple is not on board with that and when they
⏹️ ▶️ John said this is like why don’t you do what they’re doing apple but like no apple says we want you to port your games and we
⏹️ ▶️ John found two more developers who are porting games that you played three years ago.
⏹️ ▶️ John I mean the most interesting thing is like they mentioned frost funk which I don’t know much about but they mentioned control which as
⏹️ ▶️ John was one of the first sort of triple-a games to really emphasize
⏹️ ▶️ John ray tracing they’re like hey you just got an nvidia card with ray tracing support and you might know we’re not know what the hell that’s good
⏹️ ▶️ John for we’ll get control because it has the mode where you can turn on ray tracing and it looks kind cool. And again, that was years ago.
⏹️ ▶️ John Now it’s available on the Mac. As you know, Macs and iPads have ray tracing hardware in their GPUs,
⏹️ ▶️ John and so that’s a good get for them. But this is you know, this is back in time. So if you if you’ve been waiting to play control, which
⏹️ ▶️ John is a pretty cool game, you can try it out now on your Mac and Ubisoft out there talking about Prince of
⏹️ ▶️ John Persia and the new Assassin’s Creed game. So Apple is schmoozing the developers enough to get them on board.
⏹️ ▶️ John But and some of these games are not three year old games like the Assassin Creed is the upcoming one. So they their support
⏹️ ▶️ John there. So they seem to be making some headway with the big developers, right? It’s just kind of one of those things where
⏹️ ▶️ John you, Apple has to get to the point where when a cool game is coming out, a Mac
⏹️ ▶️ John user doesn’t have to think about whether it will be available on their platform. All they have to ask is, is this
⏹️ ▶️ John a platform exclusive? Because that’s what people think of all this game coming out and what they want to know is this a platform exclusive? Is it only on
⏹️ ▶️ John PlayStation? Is it only on Xbox? Right? Is it only on PC? And if they say no, it’s just it’s a cross
⏹️ ▶️ John platform game, which most AAA games are because they want to make money from everybody. When they say that Mac users know they’re still excluded.
⏹️ ▶️ John No, it’s not platform exclusive. It’s everywhere, except for the Mac, obviously.
⏹️ ▶️ John the hurdle they have to get over. And so it takes, you know, I bring up a new developer every year, say we have this game, we have that game.
⏹️ ▶️ John They have to get it to the point where gamers, when they hear a game is not platform exclusive, can assume
⏹️ ▶️ John that it’s on the Mac, and we are so far from that. But baby steps, every year there’s one more developer, one more game,
⏹️ ▶️ John it’s just at this rate, it’ll be like 2076 before that happens.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Do we know, John, if your ancient piece of garbage, slow Mac Pro is going to be able to work
⏹️ ▶️ John It seems like no. I mean, they were pretty clear. Like, I mean, they didn’t say anything
⏹️ ▶️ John about OS supported platforms. But I would assume, this is a bad assumption, previous years you would
⏹️ ▶️ John assume that if this version of Mac OS did not support Intel, they would have said it in the keynote.
⏹️ ▶️ John But in recent years, it seems like they leave unfortunate news out of the keynote and maybe
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco save it for State
⏹️ ▶️ John of the Union or something. But they didn’t say anything. So I’m assuming Sequoia still runs on
⏹️ ▶️ John Intel, minus all the features we’re gonna talk about in a little bit. But just, you know, a
⏹️ ▶️ John reader sent in a, a listener, sorry, sent in a link to our predictions from past episodes. We
⏹️ ▶️ John mentioned that in the last episode, like what were our predictions? I was kind of surprised to hear myself
⏹️ ▶️ John saying that my prediction was WWC 2024, but then I heard the reasoning that would be the exact, pretty much the
⏹️ ▶️ John exact same time span for when Apple dropped PowerPC support, which is three years and seven months after the first Intel Mac.
⏹️ ▶️ John So if you follow the same logic, they should have dropped Intel support
⏹️ ▶️ John today. I don’t think they did. So therefore, they’re going even longer with this transition. So good for them.
⏹️ ▶️ John Casey’s prediction was 2026 and Marco just waffled.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Usually that’s my cup
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco of tea. Sounds about right. Yeah. All right. All
⏹️ ▶️ Marco right. Now we have a little over an hour in. We have our first mention of
⏹️ ▶️ Marco artificial intelligence.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, this was again, I think I’m going to request and give myself an opening statement.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I felt like what we all wanted, or certainly what I wanted, and I think we talked about this last week, was we wanted
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the adults in the room. And that’s not really to slag on Microsoft necessarily,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey or Google, but we wanted somebody with a little bit of, I can’t think of ways
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to say this that aren’t going to sound mean, but here we are, and I’m very tired. So we wanted people
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that were going to have taste, and have not class,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey but just apply artificial intelligence and large language models and things like that, in
⏹️ ▶️ Casey ways that actually help regular humans. Not for me to figure out an FFMPEG incantation,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey but to do like normal stuff. And Craig comes out, or maybe it was Tim, I think it was Craig
⏹️ ▶️ Casey though. It was Tim first. Okay. And says, you know, several things I’m gonna read, these may not be verbatim
⏹️ ▶️ Casey quotes, but I think they’re worth noting. They called it Apple Intelligence, I don’t recall exactly
⏹️ ▶️ Casey when the reveal was, but they said, you know, we want to ensure that the outcome of using AI features
⏹️ ▶️ Casey reflects the principles at the core of our promise. We want them to be powerful enough to help with the things
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that matter most. They need to be intuitive and easy to use, deeply integrated
⏹️ ▶️ Casey into product experiences, and they should understand you and be grounded in your personal
⏹️ ▶️ Casey context. What is your routine? Who are your relationships with? What kind of communications do you participate
⏹️ ▶️ Casey in? And so on. And obviously privacy is a very big deal. And so they say, Oh, I think this is when the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey reveal was, it goes beyond artificial intelligence. It’s personal intelligence. It’s now Apple intelligence.
⏹️ ▶️ John And so what you were saying about being adults and it could be phrased as being less
⏹️ ▶️ John hasty, being more conservative.
⏹️ ▶️ John really what it is is Apple’s
⏹️ ▶️ John implementation of everything, as they say, it reflects a value system. Apple has a value system
⏹️ ▶️ John that informs their products. Every company does. But the thing is, the value system of many companies
⏹️ ▶️ John is unattractive to customers. So they don’t talk about it. Their value system may be, we need as
⏹️ ▶️ John much of your information as possible because we can sell ads better to it. And they don’t want to say that to you because it doesn’t make
⏹️ ▶️ John for it doesn’t make you want to buy their products. But that is their value system, and it is embodied in their product. Right.
⏹️ ▶️ John And so Apple’s value system and again, it’s not because Apple is a magnanimous or whatever. Apple’s
⏹️ ▶️ John business model does not involve selling advertisement and collecting information about you to sell to advertisers.
⏹️ ▶️ John That’s why they do this. It’s not because Apple is good, and you can say, Well, maybe, you know, because Apple does have ad type businesses
⏹️ ▶️ John or whatever. And then we’ve talked about Apple’s conflicts with their services, business versus other ones or whatever. But Apple’s value
⏹️ ▶️ John system is such that telling it to customers is advantageous for their business.
⏹️ ▶️ John And do they live up to their value system all the time? No, like we call them on, right? But they do have a value system.
⏹️ ▶️ John And if you look at the amount of work and the amount of sort of technology they put into trying
⏹️ ▶️ John to implement artificial intelligence stuff within the bounds of their value system,
⏹️ ▶️ John you see that it’s not like BS. They’re not blowing smoke up your butt. They did a lot of work that they didn’t
⏹️ ▶️ John have to do to make these features exist and fit within their value
⏹️ ▶️ John system. And the problem is this thing that’s sweeping the industry, this whole AI trend with LMS or whatever,
⏹️ ▶️ John a lot about it is counter to their value system of privacy and useful
⏹️ ▶️ John approach and making it easy for everybody. And so they had Apple had to figure out how we have to get in on this train
⏹️ ▶️ John because you know it’s it’s it’s the trend or whatever and Apple doesn’t always follow trends, but Apple sees the value that
⏹️ ▶️ John using value much. They see how good these features could be. So they said, we can’t ignore this. We have
⏹️ ▶️ John to do something here. But how do we take this thing that, by its very nature,
⏹️ ▶️ John consumes information indiscriminately, gives bogus answers to things, potentially
⏹️ ▶️ John harmful, offensive things that we don’t want? How do we figure out how to provide the benefit
⏹️ ▶️ John to people while still keeping it within our values? And I was honestly very impressed with
⏹️ ▶️ John the lengths that they have gone to to try to do what everyone else is doing in their in their catch up
⏹️ ▶️ John in a way that like I bet other companies are looking at this like they did what for what reason why would
⏹️ ▶️ John they do all that work to preserve privacy that doesn’t make any sense that you know to go fast and break
⏹️ ▶️ John things. So I was I came away really impressed with what they’ve done. I mean obviously the features that we’re
⏹️ ▶️ John going to talk about it’s like okay yeah you can every one of these features you can say someone else had this already, but I feel much
⏹️ ▶️ John more comfortable using these features in the way that Apple has implemented them and it remains to be
⏹️ ▶️ John seen in what we’ll talk about for the next year. How do they actually work? Because if you’re all wonderful
⏹️ ▶️ John and privacy preserving and deeply integrated in the operating system, but it doesn’t work well, we’ll complain about
⏹️ ▶️ John it. But it sure demoed well.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, I thought they handled it with a deft hand. I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco thought it was well done. Because, you
⏹️ ▶️ Marco know, because to keep in mind, like the environment into which they are announcing these AI
⏹️ ▶️ Marco based features, some of which are server based, you know, and this This is this is a awfully
⏹️ ▶️ Marco hostile environment, you know, in the culture right now in the media, in the press,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco even, you know, just among the public. There’s a lot of hate around a stuff these days. Yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco there’s it’s a very, very hot area and apple historically has been hit or miss
⏹️ ▶️ Marco in terms of how they’ve been able to read the room in those ways.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey That’s true,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and I was a little concerned for them going into this honestly, but I think they did a really good job with it. As john said, like I
⏹️ ▶️ Marco think their their approach to doing this in the Apple way with all the privacy focus
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and everything. I think it probably will result in not being
⏹️ ▶️ Marco as good or as capable as some of the other systems here and there, but overall I think
⏹️ ▶️ Marco what they’ve shown again we’ll see how it works, but I think what they’ve shown has a pretty good chance of working
⏹️ ▶️ Marco well enough that we will decide as Apple users. This is worth the trade
⏹️ ▶️ John I think they might have an actual advantage this time because we’ll talk to
⏹️ ▶️ John it when we get to it, I guess. But like a lot of the capabilities they’re providing require
⏹️ ▶️ John information that is not really accessible to anything except for the OS platform, you know, because they have access to everything.
⏹️ ▶️ John And normally, like you wouldn’t want to use a platform that’s like, we’re gonna take all your information and check it over the fenced
⏹️ ▶️ John open AI, right? And that will give us these amazing features. But because Apple has implemented
⏹️ ▶️ John all of their AI features in such a privacy preserving way, they feel free to pull literally anything,
⏹️ ▶️ John everything, all your relationships, all your contacts, all your photos, all your everything, because they know they’re not sending
⏹️ ▶️ John all that information to the server to be harvested for advertising purposes. They’re custom selecting just
⏹️ ▶️ John the two things you need. Uh, your wife’s name is this. Here’s a picture of her.
⏹️ ▶️ John Here’s the information we have about her. Here’s the question the person asks, and then it processes your request and
⏹️ ▶️ John discard that information. You would not want that information to being sent to
⏹️ ▶️ John arbitrary third party A. I vendors. You would never like say using this cool a tool and so it’s great. I need access all
⏹️ ▶️ John your photos and all your contacts and everything you’ve written in your messages and all your email and it’s like you would never give that
⏹️ ▶️ John it’s like well. We need that to do cool AI stuff. It’s like, but you need it all now and they’d be like yes, so as
⏹️ ▶️ John right, so I think apples apples ability to pick and choose just the slices
⏹️ ▶️ John they want should make it possible for them to add not creepier features,
⏹️ ▶️ John but features that as they said, they take your personal context into account without you feeling like
⏹️ ▶️ John you’re giving them everything. Never mind that app already has access to everything, because if you use apple photos that have all your photos, you but like the whole
⏹️ ▶️ John idea of like a lot, but doesn’t have access to your photos and then encrypted and apple doesn’t have access to your messages and then encrypted except
⏹️ ▶️ John for iCloud backups. Unless you enable advanced data protection anyway, it’s the world is complicated, but I think
⏹️ ▶️ John in this case they may actually be at an advantage here because they no longer have barriers to
⏹️ ▶️ John combining information about you to give good answers. They feel free to just yank it all because they have this
⏹️ ▶️ John very privacy preserving way that they’re doing it
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah. And I love that, you know, kind of as as expected, they are doing as much as they can
⏹️ ▶️ Marco locally on device. And that’s that’s great for privacy concerns in lots of ways, because then you can have
⏹️ ▶️ Marco even more access to things. But also, it’s great for latency and performance like that. You know, some of the biggest
⏹️ ▶️ Marco problems that I’ve always had with Siri is that it’s just so incredibly inconsistent in ways
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that feel kind of like server failures or server timeouts or things like that. And so by putting
⏹️ ▶️ Marco so much on device and of course, by also having probably a pretty strong financial incentive
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to put more and more on device over time and to minimize server requests. That is
⏹️ ▶️ Marco both good for privacy and you know you’re right like you know when they do have to send them to servers or
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to another model. They’re sending a minimal set of information and that’s good. But I
⏹️ ▶️ Marco got the impression that most requests are intended to be handled fully on device and that’s going to be just
⏹️ ▶️ Marco amazing for consistency and performance also.
⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah the one thing they don’t have with this and we talked about with learning the LM is learning and everything is they’re
⏹️ ▶️ John not pitching and they don’t certainly don’t have the idea of your own personal assistant that learns
⏹️ ▶️ John about you over time, right? That’s not this. This is like one off. So you have an agent, it can do it can answer questions,
⏹️ ▶️ John it can take commands or whatever. But it immediately forgets everything, the servers forget everything, the client forgets everything. I know they
⏹️ ▶️ John have the semantic model. And they talked about this is like, we have a semantic model. They want to say we have
⏹️ ▶️ John the equivalent of Microsoft recall database on your phone. But don’t think about that comparison, right? Because they do have this local
⏹️ ▶️ John only semantic model of all this stuff that is the stew that processed all your email
⏹️ ▶️ John and all your photos and all your other things so you can ask Siri questions find me the picture of this person with this thing or whatever and I
⏹️ ▶️ John can pull it out because it’s already done that processing but there’s no sort of like agent that learns about you because if
⏹️ ▶️ John there was it would live only on your phone and when your phone goes in a lake you would lose it
⏹️ ▶️ Marco well I think the phone is the agent in a way like like that the semantic index that you know they kept talking
⏹️ ▶️ Marco about I think what what they’re trying to do is use
⏹️ ▶️ Marco all the all the data and info that you already entrust to your phone, not do something
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like Microsoft recall or rewind AI where you not creating like a whole new record of every single thing
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John screen recording.
⏹️ ▶️ John It’s not as in readable form. It doesn’t have plain text versions and it doesn’t have screenshots, but it has hopefully that
⏹️ ▶️ John information inside it.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Right, but I think you know what they are doing seems to be you know more like a search index,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco but it’s a search index in AI terms of of information that your phone already
⏹️ ▶️ Marco is keeping. It doesn’t seem like it’s keeping new records.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John But it’s not
⏹️ ▶️ John learning anything. It’s not gaining knowledge over time to become more and more intimately familiar with you. It is always
⏹️ ▶️ John just in time what it pulls from its semantic index, and it can answer your question. But there’s no teaching it anything. Because
⏹️ ▶️ John the whole point is, if there was teaching it, what would you be teaching? Would you be teaching anything that’s only on your device? To
⏹️ ▶️ John do a learning agent that learns about you and gets smarter over time, that would have to live somewhere other than on your phone, and then introduce
⏹️ ▶️ John a whole host of other problems. So they’re not even addressing that. and you know this will crunch through the data on your
⏹️ ▶️ John phone, which is all the data in your life, and you could ask the questions and give you answer, but it’s never going to get any more
⏹️ ▶️ John knowledgeable about you other than you just adding new photos and new messages or whatever, like there’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco no learning to but I think that is learning like it. You know you can’t you can’t give a huge preamble
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to your system prompt to you know things like please speak to me only in limericks
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John like you can’t do that. I
⏹️ ▶️ John mean like learning learning like as in you know getting familiar with you and like just
⏹️ ▶️ John the dream of the eye of of thing that actually we discussed it. The large angles don’t learn in the ways that people think
⏹️ ▶️ John they do right. And Apple is not changing that here. I just I just think it’s interesting to clarify because they
⏹️ ▶️ John do have that by doing going with this approach. They do have the problem of where with this thing live, whereas all the voracious server
⏹️ ▶️ John side people like Don’t worry, it all lives in our cloud. You both suck all your information up. And if they figure out how to make that
⏹️ ▶️ John learn, don’t worry, you have your own private one and it gets smarter over time. And Apple is not that doesn’t have the
⏹️ ▶️ John ability to do that with this approach. I don’t think it’s going to hurt them because it’ll be addressed. the last episode, there
⏹️ ▶️ John is no good way to do that with LLMs right now. But if there ever is, Apple may need to,
⏹️ ▶️ John there may be a time where some intelligence needs to live somewhere other than on your phone. And I’m sure
⏹️ ▶️ John Apple will work hard to find a privacy preserving way to do that.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco All right, let’s talk about how we’re actually using this model.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep. So they talked about several different things. And it started with capabilities. So basically,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey what are we doing with this? And they talked about language. So prioritizing
⏹️ ▶️ Casey notifications, which seems like you know low hanging fruit in terms of a good way to use it. I’ve maybe a
⏹️ ▶️ Casey very difficult thing to implement, but in terms of a good way to use this sort of thing,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco are they going to prioritize down the apple store on vacation? I got this
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John morning. Oh, yeah, right you
⏹️ ▶️ Marco never you need a father’s day gift and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John it’s like oh, thank you so much apple store.
⏹️ ▶️ John This is a stupid tangent, but like you know the apple tv thing that tells you a sport score that pops over your screen. Yeah, how
⏹️ ▶️ John how do you disable that? I thought
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John had a sample. I
⏹️ ▶️ Marco went through all the settings I that drives me crazy.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John I have a way there. I have a
⏹️ ▶️ Marco way never watched a sport on apple tv ever no part of all the information apple
⏹️ ▶️ Marco knows about me would indicate that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey I like sports at all and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John gather that if I
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and yet I’m getting those sports promos on top of everything I watched in the apple tv.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I it makes me want to set it on fire.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John I know so man,
⏹️ ▶️ John there is some way to disable us. I’m sure I thought I had disabled that’s why, but I can’t so someone
⏹️ ▶️ John right in tell us how to actually disable it because it’s driving I chuck
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey your app anyway. It will
⏹️ ▶️ John prioritize those top priority and all right the movie you’re watching it’s real important for you to know the score on a sports game. You
⏹️ ▶️ Marco yeah, hopefully the hopefully apples learning index is better than now than whatever is running on the apple TV.
⏹️ ▶️ John I don’t even know what sport they’re talking about. They’re like Rogers and Harrison are in the like
⏹️ ▶️ John I don’t know who these people are. Am I supposed to know people by their last name? I can’t tell what sport you’re talking about.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, all right, so then there’s new writing tools that are available system wide. They made mention. I forget how they
⏹️ ▶️ Casey phrased it, but basically anywhere you would have a text field an actual Apple-vended text field.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey You can do rewrite, you can summarize. At some point, they talked about changing the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey tone. That might have been email-specific, I don’t recall. But you can change the tone of things.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco I think it’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco anywhere. I think all these, this entire feature class is called rewrite. And I think this is in any standard
⏹️ ▶️ Marco text field, like Craig Federighi said in the Don’t Call It A Talk Show fake talk show they held afterwards, that it
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey works. We should probably explain what that is in a minute, but carry on.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco basically that it works. It works anywhere that you currently see things like spellcheck. Any
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John system. Yeah, third party
⏹️ ▶️ John Anywhere you see those standard controls. I believe Mac OS 8 had a way to select text
⏹️ ▶️ John and summarize it. We’ve come a long way. That
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco summarization
⏹️ ▶️ John was not very good. I believe it would just pick the most relevant sentences based on analysis, just string those together, which worked about as
⏹️ ▶️ John well as you can imagine. Another catch up feature, every app that we’ve used with AI enhancement
⏹️ ▶️ John has a feature to summarize it and rewrite it and fix the right. But you know, they’re implementing it well. It’s system
⏹️ ▶️ John wide. It’s available to third parties. We hope it works well.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think it does make me a little bit uneasy that like, all right, so here we are. We’re having AI
⏹️ ▶️ Marco generate and edit our messages that are going to be sent to someone else who’s going to use AI to summarize
⏹️ ▶️ Marco them. And it’s like, what are we doing? Like,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John what? This seems like such a waste. I mean,
⏹️ ▶️ John in some respects, like you would hope that this will teach people to be better writers
⏹️ ▶️ John when they see how things are rewritten. Do calculators teach people how to do but map
⏹️ ▶️ John Not it’s not quite the same, because you just care about the answer with the calculator, where I assume
⏹️ ▶️ John people will read the revised writing to see if it is acceptable to them.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco Maybe that’s not that’s a big assumption. I know, but
⏹️ ▶️ John like things like that, I think you can learn by seeing you know
⏹️ ▶️ John seeing how if you have even had a human editor revise your writing and you watch them do it, you will
⏹️ ▶️ John eventually become a better. I’m not saying this is tool to become a better writer, but I I think there is some learning happening there, because a lot of
⏹️ ▶️ John time people just write a certain way and they don’t think about it. And just having somebody rewrite their stuff,
⏹️ ▶️ John like even if it’s a computer, and then seeing, oh, that actually is better that way, can teach them to be a better writer
⏹️ ▶️ John in small ways. But we’ll see how much people actually use these features. And for people not reading, that’s
⏹️ ▶️ John obviously the danger cases like, oh, I don’t I’ll just hit this button and then I’ll hit send. People are gonna
⏹️ ▶️ John get burned by that. They’re gonna learn, oh, maybe I should read what I wrote. Like it’s just
⏹️ ▶️ John it’s one of those things tools to give you enough rope to hang yourself and I think this is the case with that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I do like though like that one of the options so first of all rewrites going to give you like a really really good proofread you
⏹️ ▶️ Marco know grammar check kind of thing it’s gonna be more advanced than most grammar checks isn’t there a service grammarly is
⏹️ ▶️ Marco whatever uses for this so like that’s good to have that be on device to to not have basically a key logger from someone else
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that’s good but also like I like that they have tone changes as one of the options to rewrite messages so
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you can make your writing more formal or whatever and I think that’s not or like you know to have different sentiment
⏹️ ▶️ Marco analysis to have it be maybe less negative. That I think is going to be nice for people who maybe are not great
⏹️ ▶️ Marco at that kind of writing or even that kind of
⏹️ ▶️ John mean, like forum software has had stuff like that for years where they’ll say, before you hit send on this message,
⏹️ ▶️ John it seems pretty aggressive.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco You sure you
⏹️ ▶️ John don’t want to comment down? People have been using it to try to make people be less obnoxious online. And
⏹️ ▶️ John I tried to write down the tone things, but they were all nice. It was like, do you want your tone to be more
⏹️ ▶️ John concise, or more friendly, or more conciliatory? where is the more aggressive setting?
⏹️ ▶️ John I wanted to be more assertive. I want it to be like you maybe you’re negotiating for real estate
⏹️ ▶️ John over email or something like that wasn’t in the options and I kind of understand that because the thing will just start threatening people’s
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco or whatever right
⏹️ ▶️ John make me a better negotiate right, but this is part of the being conservative with like this. Let’s just have all the tone settings
⏹️ ▶️ John to be make you sound nicer and none of them to be because sometimes you do want to be more assertive, but I will not it’s
⏹️ ▶️ John too dangerous for I to help you with that at this point with respect,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I don’t think that you needed to be more assertive about the locking.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John I was so nice about
⏹️ ▶️ John I was just mostly incredulous.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco No, it’s good to like, you know, for people who people who are trying to like write up like a formal business email or something and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco maybe maybe they don’t have that kind of writing skill or maybe they don’t know English that well. Like I think I think this has a lot of
⏹️ ▶️ Marco really good applications, but I think we are definitely gonna have the problem of people not reading
⏹️ ▶️ Marco what it’s what I wrote and just sending
⏹️ ▶️ John it. You know, and then people don’t read emails anyway. These are all… Us
⏹️ ▶️ John exchanging so much text is such a big change from when I was a kid, when people did not exchange text this much,
⏹️ ▶️ John period, in their entire lives. They didn’t write letters to each other and there was no text messaging,
⏹️ ▶️ John no email, no this. Now people work with text so much more. I think it is making people better writers.
⏹️ ▶️ John And I think you learn, when you get your first job, where you have to do job email, oh, job email is different than text
⏹️ ▶️ John messages. Kids will learn that when they get their first job and realize they can’t address their
⏹️ ▶️ John co-workers and boss the same way. And there’s a culture that devolves around that. And for better
⏹️ ▶️ John or for worse, we all learn how to write work emails. And having computers help out with that,
⏹️ ▶️ John maybe we’ll just smooth that curve a little bit. Please advise.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So the language stuff is in MailNotes, Safari Pages, Keynote, and third-party apps, as John had mentioned. Then we
⏹️ ▶️ Casey get to images. I don’t know why I wrote down photos, emojis, and GIFs. But
⏹️ ▶️ Casey apparently that was mentioned. you get like a bit moji style generated images
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John It’s more like a memoji, isn’t
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it? Doesn’t it look kind of like them?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey sort of. But then you’ve got like the backgrounds and they’re interact or they’re not interact, but they’re like holding things,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey which is more bit moji. I don’t know. I mean, it’s one way or the other,
⏹️ ▶️ John but yeah, now they can take what is saying is you have pictures of people in your in your contacts in your photos collection that
⏹️ ▶️ John it has identified using the people in places feature. You can ask it to draw you a cartoony picture
⏹️ ▶️ John of that person, which is brave.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco it yes, because car to old
⏹️ ▶️ John move car to any pictures of people can go wrong in many many ways, and this is an apple feature, not
⏹️ ▶️ John an open a feature which you get you in a little bit. This is an apple feature, so if apple hoses this
⏹️ ▶️ John it’s going to there’s going to be press about it. There’s a lot of ways.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco Yeah, wrong,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco but they’ve been very careful with certain
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John things. I mean yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco don’t make my nose too big or whatever, like I bet there’s a lot of that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John kind of stuff in there.
⏹️ ▶️ John of all, they don’t want to make it something on flattering because people don’t want to see on a flattering picture of themselves and second, I think it’s got the same problem that always complain
⏹️ ▶️ John about emoji emoji is that, unlike the Mies and Nintendo Memoji all have little pumpkin
⏹️ ▶️ John heads and my heads, not a pumpkin. It’s a football right like like like they just they
⏹️ ▶️ John just regularize everybody into like you know, like the little the little people from play school
⏹️ ▶️ John or whatever like that everyone looks like a doll and then you and then you don’t see yourself in that you like that you have not captured
⏹️ ▶️ John my likeness. That doesn’t look like me right. This seems like it’s going to try to capture people’s likenesses. So when
⏹️ ▶️ John you paste it into a chat or whatever generated in way, people go, oh, that’s Timmy.
⏹️ ▶️ John I recognize his face. It’s not just because Timmy has brown hair, and it’s just a round pumpkin head with brown
⏹️ ▶️ John hair on it. So this is the first sort of like potential danger zone
⏹️ ▶️ John of the features they’ve got. Because all the other ones like text summarization, helping you with writing, changing the sentiment nicer,
⏹️ ▶️ John this has the potential to go wrong. But anyway, it’s part of their image generation framework. It can make people for
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Indeed. And you can do it as sketches, illustrations, or animations. And it’s built
⏹️ ▶️ Casey built into the system apps. Then another capability, action. They gave, basically
⏹️ ▶️ Casey what they’re saying is you can say, I think to Siri was the implication.
⏹️ ▶️ John This is such a weird structure of the thing. We’ve talked about it before of like, how are they going to talk about the OS is about talking about AI
⏹️ ▶️ John features. And the fact is they didn’t, they talked about AI features. They just didn’t call them AI. How are they going to talk about Siri when
⏹️ ▶️ John they haven’t introduced Siri yet? They just talked about it and they just didn’t mention Siri. Like
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey later they’re going to mention Siri.
⏹️ ▶️ John was, it was a straight, normally they have a way to arrange it so they can talk about what they want about it. They couldn’t They had to
⏹️ ▶️ John talk about things that they hadn’t quote unquote talked about yet. And this is one. Yes, you’re asking Siri.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So the examples they gave, you’ll pull up the files that Joss shared with me last week, or show me all the photos with
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Declan and Michaela and Aaron and me, or show me the podcast that my wife sent last week. I was happy to hear that.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And so, you know, I wasn’t, I can’t do that.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey my point is just that I’m always pleased when Apple acknowledges a podcast or a thing.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey but yeah, I think these make a lot of sense. I think this is the sort of thing we want to see from Siri is making it more useful.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey They also said a lot about personal context, and they started to flirt a little bit with like Rewind AI
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and what is it, recall that Microsoft has been embroiled over. But they said that there
⏹️ ▶️ Casey is an awareness of what’s on the screen.
⏹️ ▶️ John say that. That was my… They showed things that said, hey, when you’re on the screen, that’s the context. And so when you say
⏹️ ▶️ John something like, oh, send this to whatever, or like… I’m assuming it’s not OCRing
⏹️ ▶️ John the screen and scraping info. So I’m assuming this is all like user activity APIs and Apple’s apps
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey that have integration. I don’t know if that’s
⏹️ ▶️ Casey true. Well, I don’t think that’s exclusively true. Because one of the examples they showed, at some point, it might
⏹️ ▶️ Casey not have been at this part of the presentation, but somebody sent their address in a text message thread. So
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you and I are exchanging messages. You send me your mailing address. And they said to Siri,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey add that address to his contact, or something along those lines.
⏹️ ▶️ John But Siri has full access to messages.
⏹️ ▶️ John Apple’s own app. If that was WhatsApp, what would it have done?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I see your point. Yeah, I’m not sure. That’s a good point. I’m not
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John entirely sure.
⏹️ ▶️ John Honestly, I think because of the way they’re doing this, I would have no problem with it screen scraping and OCRing it
⏹️ ▶️ John because I know that it is just getting the information it wants, it’s sending it to a server that doesn’t log it, that has no ability to store things,
⏹️ ▶️ John and it throws it away.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco Right. That’s so much better.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco It is also probably issues with the accessibility APIs. Like, it’s probably
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John already all easy. There are lots of, like I said,
⏹️ ▶️ John there’s NS user activity. Or not NS, but there’s user activity API. There’s the other various ways
⏹️ ▶️ John where this information is exposed to the OS, to the frameworks that you’re using, because you’re not, you know, you’re using the UI framework.
⏹️ ▶️ John So there’s lots of ways they can do this. And that is the advantage they have as the platform vendor. And
⏹️ ▶️ John being context aware in this way is great, because when they said about context, like, how are we providing context? You’re providing
⏹️ ▶️ John context by just using your phone. Whatever you’re doing on your phone, that is the context. And then you activate
⏹️ ▶️ John the new Siri, which we’ll see in a little bit. And you don’t have to do anything to provide the context. It’s already there. And the OS
⏹️ ▶️ John sort of extracts that from what you’re doing and what you have done, right? Because the OS knows all that.
⏹️ ▶️ John and uses that to hopefully get a more useful answer out of the LLM.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So I talked about architecture. I feel like maybe we should try to breeze through this as quickly as possible.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey But basically, they made a whole speech about how privacy is important. And of
⏹️ ▶️ Casey course, they cited that on-device processing is where they’re doing most of this, which
⏹️ ▶️ Casey leads us to Apple Intelligence being Apple Silicon only, apparently A17 Pro and
⏹️ ▶️ Casey above. They talked about how there’s different models. There’s LLMs
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and diffusion models. They have an on-device semantic index. The software image,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey they made a lot of, they talked a lot about how their images,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey which they meant both for the iPhone and for their servers, which we’re going to get to in two seconds,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey are independently verifiable. And I’m not entirely clear how or
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John why or what. All they’re
⏹️ ▶️ John saying is like, you know how security researchers can find flaws in iOS because they have iOS?
⏹️ ▶️ John That’s the same thing.
⏹️ ▶️ John servers, There was no reason for you to give them what’s there. Now, anyone listening to this who’s not an Apple fan is like, why don’t they just give
⏹️ ▶️ John them the source code? That’s
⏹️ ▶️ John yet the Apple way. But honestly, analyzing a compiled binary is much harder than analyzing the
⏹️ ▶️ John source code. But that’s the way it is.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So they talk about private cloud compute, which basically, the short short of it is they try to do everything
⏹️ ▶️ Casey on device when they can, including a lot of the image generation, I think they had said at one point, that they do that on device.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey But there is an awareness that, oh, this is not going to work on device. I got to send this to
⏹️ ▶️ Casey something with with more compute power. And so they’re using servers that
⏹️ ▶️ Casey are in turn using Apple silicon that draws on the security properties of Swift,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey among other things, which I’m not entirely
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John clear what that does mean, like memory safety and stuff like this,
⏹️ ▶️ John this private cloud compute finally makes sense is a sense of the room where we talked about in past episode about using
⏹️ ▶️ John Apple silicon and service finally makes sense, right? And not because of the security, it’s because
⏹️ ▶️ John this is stuff they would run on device. They’re just farming it out, and if you’re going to farm it out, you have to farm
⏹️ ▶️ John it out to you don’t have to, but it’s much easier to farm it out to the same architecture. I would run an Apple Silicon,
⏹️ ▶️ John but it would burn your CPU or you don’t have enough RAM. Well, guess what? Apple makes bigger Apple Silicon chips. Finally,
⏹️ ▶️ John it’s like why would they use the M two ultra? This is why it’s it’s Apple Silicon. It is think
⏹️ ▶️ John of it as just an outboard giant processor for your phone that you call upon briefly to do a thing
⏹️ ▶️ John and get the answer back. That may I feel so much better. I’m like, why are they doing this? Why are they making a server?
⏹️ ▶️ John And so yeah, and they’ll give you they’ll give you the image of the thing that’s running on that server. And we’ll do a cryptographic
⏹️ ▶️ John thing where you know, you can prove that iOS won’t talk to it unless it’s been the one piece that didn’t mention is like, there’s got to
⏹️ ▶️ John be a third party involved in here. Otherwise, we’re just taking Apple’s word for it that will only let you use the published ones. But this they’re
⏹️ ▶️ John bending over backwards, like they’re going almost as far enough to give you the source code to it and saying,
⏹️ ▶️ John we’re going to do outboard processing, we don’t want any of your data. These things can’t log. They
⏹️ ▶️ John have no storage system subsystem. They’re running like a version of Apple’s operating systems that takes those parts
⏹️ ▶️ John of the operating system out. There’s no support for persistent storage. There’s
⏹️ ▶️ John no file system. Like it’s just so
⏹️ ▶️ John you see this a lot in the cloud computing world. They’ll have servers that can’t log, that don’t save you any information. This
⏹️ ▶️ John is what they’re doing because they don’t want this information. It’s cheaper for them not to have it and they are really
⏹️ ▶️ John really going to great lengths to try to to make it so that an outside observer could say, yes, they’re honestly
⏹️ ▶️ John not saving my stuff, but they do want to be able to do things faster than
⏹️ ▶️ John they can on your phone or with more ram than they can in your phone. This is a very clever solution. I’m much more
⏹️ ▶️ John optimistic about it now than I was before.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah. And the other thing that I think worth mentioning is Marco alluded to a quasi talk show that we went
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to and then we ignored it after that. But what we had done was short during the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey state of the union. Actually, they had I Justine interview John Gianandrea, I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey was the pronunciation
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco and- Tim Cook
⏹️ ▶️ Marco didn’t say, Tim Cook just
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey called him JG. That’s what everyone called him. Yeah. Yeah. John Gianandrea.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey But anyways, they had a conversation and it was like half an hour long and
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it was mostly softballs and mostly it appeared to be, you know, prepared both remarks
⏹️ ▶️ Casey questions. But one of the things that Justine had asked was, well, you never really talked about
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the environment and this all comes back together because I forget who it was, but one of of them said, look,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey all of our chips began life as iPhone chips, where power is incredibly important.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And so if we’re going to do all this cloud computing, why wouldn’t we try to do
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it on something that sips power rather than slurps power? And so here again, like you were saying, John, this also
⏹️ ▶️ Casey helps me grok and understand why they’re doing all this with Apple Silicon.
⏹️ ▶️ John And they emphasize, oh, and by the way, all data centers run on 100% renewable energy
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey anyway. Yep, exactly right. So anyway,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey so experiences. Now we get to Siri. So Siri apparently serves 1.5 billion requests per day.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And it was introduced 13 years ago.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I think that was my first WWDC then, because that would make it 2011, wouldn’t it? It doesn’t matter.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco introduced in 2011, but yeah, my first was 2009. Right, I was 11.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey And that was your first as well,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey right, John? Sorry, I’m looking at John and pointing, which is not helpful for the listeners.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey We don’t do this in person often. So anyways, it’s more natural, relevant, and personal. It has a whole
⏹️ ▶️ Casey new look. It’s like a glowing rim light and
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco rainbow animation. It’s a cool look. I also
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like how there’s a little bit of an indentation animation
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John where the button is where you’re squeezing it. That’s kind of a cool look.
⏹️ ▶️ John We were talking about in the pundit world, are
⏹️ ▶️ John they going to rename Siri? Because the old one has such bad PR, like it’s so dumb. Everyone hates Siri. Maybe they’ll call it Siri
⏹️ ▶️ John X or Siri 10 or something like that. Not that they would rename it, but it rebranded. Siri AI, another possibility,
⏹️ ▶️ John right? And then people are like, oh, no, they’ll just keep this name the same. will tell us really this time it’s good right.
⏹️ ▶️ John They did something that I hadn’t heard anyone predict, which is you know keep the name the same, which a lot of people did say that they would do,
⏹️ ▶️ John but they essentially totally rebranded Siri. The icon is different. The user
⏹️ ▶️ John interface is different. How it manifests in the os is different. It is you would be forgiven
⏹️ ▶️ John for thinking that the series gone has been replaced with something new. They like I didn’t think they would change the
⏹️ ▶️ John icon like that iconic like Siri. Look with the way we everything gone. Now there’s a colorful infinity symbol
⏹️ ▶️ John thing or whatever the icons out of the menu bar like everything about this is
⏹️ ▶️ John rebranded, except it’s still serious, but like this is really trying to let people know this is
⏹️ ▶️ John you may have been annoyed with Siri and we didn’t change the name, but this is better,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey but everything is better. Yeah, so they made a big point about how it will understand you, even if you stumble over your
⏹️ ▶️ Casey words, which I use Siri most when I’m in the car because I’m using it with car play and I’m
⏹️ ▶️ Casey responding to text messages or whatever the me be. I don’t know what my problem is. I literally talk for a living.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey That is literally my vocation. And yet I am constantly stumbling over my own words. And
⏹️ ▶️ Casey so hopefully that’ll get a lot better. It maintains the conversational context. And they gave
⏹️ ▶️ Casey examples that you would expect. I can’t recall any of them right now, but it was what you would expect. So do this and then,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey okay, what about, or, you know, you’re taking several steps in a
⏹️ ▶️ John Because the context window is a natural part of LLMs and
⏹️ ▶️ John this fits well with
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that. There’s type to Siri. So you can double tap on the bottom of the screen and And then you can type kind
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of, sort of like a chatbot, which I think there’s a type
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John to Siri already. You can type to Siri now,
⏹️ ▶️ John but they’re just exposing it more broadly. Because a lot of the time, the barrier to using Siri is I don’t want to talk out loud right now.
⏹️ ▶️ John In whatever context I’m in, I don’t want to or can’t. And so this gives it a more prominent option to something
⏹️ ▶️ John you could do before, but most people probably didn’t know how to access.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey They’re giving Siri a lot of product knowledge,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco which I was like, I’m sorry. What products?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey What? So they said, you can ask Siri, how do I scan a QR code? And once it processes and
⏹️ ▶️ Casey realizes what you’re asking, it will show like a little help thing at the top of the screen saying,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey step one, do this, step two, do that, step three, do this, which I thought was phenomenal. And another example they gave very
⏹️ ▶️ Casey quickly is, how do I write a message now and schedule to send later? And so it will tell you, it will teach you how to do
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that, which I thought was very cool.
⏹️ ▶️ John Although they didn’t go through with that as like, do those instructions stay on the screen? How can you
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco access the UI when they’re there? But it’s better
⏹️ ▶️ John than nothing. But yeah, to be clear, they didn’t say this explicitly. I’m assuming it’s only Apple products.
⏹️ ▶️ John refrigerator? Like, they’re not on board for that, but I will definitely use this, because very often I want
⏹️ ▶️ John to Google for something and find like a text back, like how deep does it go? Can I ask it what the resolution was
⏹️ ▶️ John on like the second iPad or something? Like, I mean, Apple has this info.
⏹️ ▶️ John It’s great that they’re exposing it. Maybe it’s mostly useful for tech podcasters, but I’m looking forward to it.
⏹️ ▶️ John It’s just a KBase index at this point. Yeah, I mean, yeah, but by all means, make it, it’s like a better search engine
⏹️ ▶️ John for information that’s already on Apple’s website somewhere, but you’ll never find.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Unfortunately, John, I don’t think it will prepare the way for you. So I wouldn’t try that.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey There’s in-app actions. So add this photo to the email I drafted to Steve, or show
⏹️ ▶️ Casey me photos of Stacey in New York wearing her pink coat. Like that example in particular,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I find that one of the things I miss so deeply about Google Photos, which was
⏹️ ▶️ Casey also not perfect, but at the time that I abandoned it a couple of years ago, was pretty darn good, was being
⏹️ ▶️ Casey able to search for something with natural language. and apple has supported this for
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the last couple of years, but it’s not great.
⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah, they have they had a fixed set of words and phrases that
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey you use and if it wasn’t
⏹️ ▶️ John on there, you’re you know, I I remember like I have an app on my phone called query
⏹️ ▶️ John able and I showed this to an apple person at one point and I said I use this third party
⏹️ ▶️ John app to search photos. They’re like why don’t you just use the photo search,
⏹️ ▶️ John type things or whatever, and I showed them an example and it was like ripped blue t shirt or some phrase like that query
⏹️ ▶️ John a third-party app that has to grind over and index all your things, but that uses type and L on type thing? Like, look, it found
⏹️ ▶️ John it instantly. And you know the photos didn’t have ripped blue T-shirt as any one of the keywords, so you would never
⏹️ ▶️ John find it. And finally, Apple has caught up with that and saying, yes, you just type what you want to find. We’ll do our best to
⏹️ ▶️ John find it. We’re not confining you to keywords. Powered by modern technology. I’m
⏹️ ▶️ John very happy to see this.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Me too. I hope it works really well, because this is one of those things, and this is what, to bring it full circle, what
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I was talking about earlier, and not to say that you guys disagree at all, but this is what I want to see. Take something
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that is frigging painful in my life. I know that I took a picture of
⏹️ ▶️ Casey me and Marco on the Nuremberg Ring, and I know that it was sometime in 2013, and yes, I could drill
⏹️ ▶️ Casey in via map, but I forget where the Nuremberg Ring
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John is in Germany. And you’re scrolling, and you didn’t find the month, there’s
⏹️ ▶️ John so many photos there, and
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey you go past it because it’s just one picture. Right,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey yeah, it’s so frustrating. This is the moment that I want the adults in the room to fix
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that problem. And as far as we know so far, They’re fixing it, so I’m here
⏹️ ▶️ Casey for it. They also said you can do something like say, make this photo pop. But I guess it increases saturation
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John or something on those slides. They’re
⏹️ ▶️ John showing they have funny ways for you to hit a button in the UI.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Significant enhancements to App Intents. And this was kind of hinted at or obliquely mentioned
⏹️ ▶️ Casey many, many, many times. But basically, the App Intents system, and Marco, I’m happy for you to jump in whenever you’re ready.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey But the App Intents system is powering a lot of what Siri is doing, which is exactly, I think,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey what Marco, you had predicted. Yeah.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey It’s what I’ve been hoping for
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that because it’s a way for apps to expose different actions like, you know, play a podcast, you know, send email
⏹️ ▶️ Marco or whatever the to the shortcut system so far and that’s great for shortcuts users, but there’s not that many shortcuts
⏹️ ▶️ Marco users. So this is like what they’re doing is expanding the system
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and basically adding it to the semantic index. So that way at some
⏹️ ▶️ Marco point rolling out slowly over the next year or so, you You know, Siri will first
⏹️ ▶️ Marco be able to access those app intents and start
⏹️ ▶️ Marco doing actions like, you know, give me a list of all the podcasts and overcast
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that they never set up a shortcut for. That it can use the app intent system
⏹️ ▶️ Marco with AI approaches and, you know, linguistic analysis to look at the descriptions and actions
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and kind of try to figure out what you actually meant and then actually do that in those apps. What they showed today
⏹️ ▶️ Marco is the early foundations of that. It’s going to be a while before we can actually really do that.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And a lot of this stuff is kind of hand-wavy as like, soon this will be available, or later in the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco year, or next year. But this is good. This is exactly what I was hoping to see. This is a great
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep. Couldn’t agree more. They also gave another great example. Siri, when’s my mom’s flight landing? And it was pulling
⏹️ ▶️ Casey together not only the email that has her flight number, but also what
⏹️ ▶️ Casey is the actual arrival time for that flight. And again, this is smart, useful,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey useful ways to solve problems for people.
⏹️ ▶️ John a question about that though. A lot of the examples they were showing were like, oh, and we pulled this from your email or whatever.
⏹️ ▶️ John And they did show the superhuman email app at one point, but like my question is, I don’t use the mail app. Does it
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco have no access to my
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco because it’s from
⏹️ ▶️ John Google? I understand it’s a third party integration problem. Google’s not gonna wanna share that with you. Google already does a lot
⏹️ ▶️ John of these things. Google will read my emails, knows where my flights are, gives me summaries and so on and so forth, But it seems like, because
⏹️ ▶️ John I use Gmail, nothing in my email will be exposed to Siri, which will make it less useful for me. And that is actually
⏹️ ▶️ John a problem for Apple, because a lot of people do use third-party mail clients. And I hope Apple at least comes
⏹️ ▶️ John up with a way to integrate with Siri for third-party email
⏹️ ▶️ John apps that then Google can ignore for three years, like they did with, what was it, multitasking in iOS? What was
⏹️ ▶️ John the feature they didn’t add to iOS
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco for you? Yeah, for the iPad, right? I mean, this is probably
⏹️ ▶️ Marco all part of the Spotlight APIs. I don’t know to what degree, I don’t
⏹️ ▶️ Marco know if we know yet, like through documentation and everything, to what degree the existing Spotlight APIs are being
⏹️ ▶️ Marco used to feed the semantic index from third-party apps. I don’t think we know that. But that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco is the way to do it. And so that’s probably one of those other areas that we’ll also see like over
⏹️ ▶️ Marco time, we’re gonna probably see them start making these APIs slowly more integrated,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco more public with the semantic index and allow third-party apps to add data to it.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco whether the apps will is a
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John very different question. Google is not motivated to
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey do this. Google
⏹️ ▶️ John has no spotlight support. Google has its own search, which is very good. But it’s kind of a shame that the
⏹️ ▶️ John usefulness of Siri depends highly on having access to things
⏹️ ▶️ John like your email that it just may not have access to if you don’t use Apple Mail.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So they said it’s a new era for Siri. Then you can enhance your writing. We spoke about most of this already.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey But there’s smart reply in mail. And what I thought was interesting was, if you,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey if, like I write to the boys, you know, hey, when are you going to San Jose?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey What is your flight number? When are you getting in, et cetera, et cetera. So I have like a list of questions, right? What they had was like
⏹️ ▶️ Casey a wizard sort of interface where you would just say, okay, my flight number’s one, two, three, four. I get
⏹️ ▶️ Casey in on Sunday and I’ll be in at 5 p.m. or whatever. And then it would, based on my answer,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey their answers, I guess, it would draft an email that would say, you know, hey, I’m getting in at such and such a time and blah,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey blah, blah. And I thought that was very neat.
⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah. And people are like, oh, don’t you want to write that email yourself? Especially on a phone, if you’re on the
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey don’t have time
⏹️ ▶️ John to tap out an email. But you just want to say, yes, I’ll be there, and I’ll be there at 8, or no, I’m not coming. And you don’t want to have to type out
⏹️ ▶️ John that email. This is a useful feature. You called it a wizard using the Microsoft terminology.
⏹️ ▶️ John It’s turning what would be a typing exercise into a button pressing exercise. And when you’re on the go, especially on the
⏹️ ▶️ John watch, I don’t know if this is exposed on the watch, but even on the phone, sometimes you don’t want to sit there and grab your phone with two hands and type,
⏹️ ▶️ John type, type, or whatever. give this feature a big thumbs up.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Mail, previews in mail. So what I was going to say is previews in mail, now summaries, what does that even mean?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So when you’re looking at your inbox, for example, and you’ll see the first two or three lines
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of text from that email, oftentimes that’s like a, hey, how’s it going? Hey, we spoke about
⏹️ ▶️ Casey this. Well, now what that’s going to show is a summary of the email. Two very big thumbs up
⏹️ ▶️ Casey for me if that’s what’s happening, or if it works well, I guess I should say.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And it also will bubble up priority messages. Same thing with notifications, priority at the top, you’ll get
⏹️ ▶️ Casey summaries, et cetera. They specifically enumerated, oh, if the group chat is popping off,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you’ll get a summary of it, which is great. Focus has a reduced interruptions mode. And they
⏹️ ▶️ Casey showed a screenshot of like maybe important. And I think it was like a ride share or something like that. I forget exactly what it was.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey They had a section about expressing yourself and they talked about Genmoji. So
⏹️ ▶️ Casey what you can do is you can type a T-Rex wearing a tuxedo on a surfboard, and then you’ll get
⏹️ ▶️ Casey a T-Rex, an emoji-looking thing of a T-Rex wearing a tuxedo on a surfboard.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco If this works, that’s really cool.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey It’s basically
⏹️ ▶️ Marco an emoji generator that generates new art in the style of
⏹️ ▶️ John great. This is a clever idea to choose to do this particular feature because the images generated
⏹️ ▶️ John are low resolution. That’s true. That’s faster to generate.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco Oh, that’s interesting, yeah. They
⏹️ ▶️ John picked very tiny images. Very often, the AI image generator will make you a thumbnail first.
⏹️ ▶️ John And if you really like it, it’ll do the longer processing for the bigger thing. But these are all fast and presumably on device
⏹️ ▶️ John and presumably trained on Apple’s own emoji. That was one of the questions, by the way, that I just seen asked that they said, and you may be wondering,
⏹️ ▶️ John listen to this, is where they asked Apple, where did you, what did you use to train all
⏹️ ▶️ John your AI models, right? And their answer was not great.
⏹️ ▶️ John I was hoping that they would have touted in the thing. And by the way, everything we train these with is information that
⏹️ ▶️ John we own. But what they said instead was, we trained it on publicly
⏹️ ▶️ John available information on the web, yada, yada. Like, they didn’t have a story, kind of like Adobe
⏹️ ▶️ John or whatever, of like, look, we paid for our own, all the information we trained this on. It’s not on any of your user
⏹️ ▶️ John data. It’s just on like stock photos that we bought or licensed. We licensed things from New York time. They didn’t say
⏹️ ▶️ John that. They trained it on publicly available information. So Apple is not
⏹️ ▶️ John currently entirely immune to whatever the fallout is of the legal ramifications of
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep, so they have an image playground, which this
⏹️ ▶️ Casey is where we’re starting to jump the shark a little bit. But it could be cool. So what this is, is
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it’s inline, or I believe they said in a dedicated app, and you can create playful images. There are themes,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey costumes, accessories, places, and more. It all happens on device, and you can use different styles, like we mentioned
⏹️ ▶️ Casey before, animation, sketch, or illustration. There are suggestions related to personal context.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey You can do this, I think, in many different places. And this is creating like a, what was
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the image generator thing you just said it a second ago? The
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John stable diffusion.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey It’s giving like a stable diffusion style image.
⏹️ ▶️ John This is 2024 clip art. Yeah, actually it’s,
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey yeah. That’s what it, but they really showed it
⏹️ ▶️ John being used as clip art. You need an image of something, now you can just describe what it is, or if you did a sketch
⏹️ ▶️ John of something, they showed someone, they drew like an outline of something, you can just say, take this and make it into a picture. And they even showed, hey,
⏹️ ▶️ John maybe you didn’t provide an illustration. Maybe you wrote a note or a document and you just circle the
⏹️ ▶️ John blank area next to it and miss as make me an image and it will look at the text and figure based on that text. Here’s what the
⏹️ ▶️ John image should be. I presume that this was trained only on known
⏹️ ▶️ John licensed images, because this is a big danger zone. But if they train it only on like if there’s no porn
⏹️ ▶️ John in there right, it’s not going to generate those type of things right. It seems very constrained
⏹️ ▶️ John and it’s just the interface is wacky and weird and really
⏹️ ▶️ John it’s like a glowing blob on these things floating around it. I’m not sure that’s the right choice for this feature, but anyway,
⏹️ ▶️ John if you need to generate a I look in stock art that everyone will know way I was a I generated.
⏹️ ▶️ John You can use this feature to do it. It’s available to third parties. It’s available as a dedicated app. It appears in lots of places.
⏹️ ▶️ John It’s blobby and weird, and I think this is the most sort of out there feature they decided to add. That
⏹️ ▶️ John is a questionable utility of questionable legality based on what they’ve told us, and
⏹️ ▶️ John I think all the stuff that it generates is kind of recognizable as having been generated.
⏹️ ▶️ John But you know, it’s better than I guess doing what other people what people did before features like this, which is that you just Google,
⏹️ ▶️ John you just type what you want in Google, you make it an image search, you grab some energy found on the web, yank in and put it in your thing.
⏹️ ▶️ John And this is probably better than
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that. They mentioned a few other things, photo editing, they have a cleanup tool, magic eraser style thing,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey searching using natural language, which we talked about the memory movies, which I actually really enjoy those, they’re
⏹️ ▶️ Casey clearly a very naive implementation, but they’re fun and I guess they’re gonna get a lot
⏹️ ▶️ Casey better, or you could even type a description and it’ll assemble the movie for you. They even said including chapters. I’m
⏹️ ▶️ Casey not sure if they literally mean chapters or if they mean like different phases
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John and stuff. Like a title
⏹️ ▶️ John card or whatever. And by the way, the way the third party thing of like scribbling over an image or whatever, that’s their
⏹️ ▶️ John magic wand tool. It’s part of like pencil kit. The little pencil thing that you see lets you pick like a highlighter or a pencil,
⏹️ ▶️ John a pen or whatever. Now you have a new tool, which is like a magician’s magic wand, And that’s the thing
⏹️ ▶️ John you use in any document where you’re using pencil kit and that thing appears, you can just grab the magic wand and circle something
⏹️ ▶️ John that you drew and it will make an image out of it.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep. And then Craig comes back to say that notes will record and transcribe audio.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And then I believe he said you can also do this on a phone
⏹️ ▶️ Casey part of that is that it will notify you. They didn’t explain how, but notify you
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and the other party, I should make it clear, they will notify both parties that the recording has started and
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that will be part of the phone call, and then it will record and transcribe it.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, and summarize it afterwards.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey Right, right, right.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So all common voice meeting features.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And then all this is available for free on new OSes. Then they talked about, hey, what if you need to do something
⏹️ ▶️ Casey more, like something more intense that requires more general knowledge, et cetera, et cetera. So
⏹️ ▶️ Casey we’ve partnered with ChatGPT and GPT 4.0, and Siri can leverage ChatGPT.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And what we’ve talked about, and we are not the only ones, is, well, how does Apple make make it clear that if this
⏹️ ▶️ Casey gets gross or weird or whatever, that’s not on us. That’s them
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco over there. That’s the weird. That’s
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the double popped collar weirdos over there. Don’t blame us. And so what happens is as you’re using Syria, we’ll
⏹️ ▶️ Casey say, Hey, I forget exactly how it’s verbalized, but basically, you know, I can’t do this chat.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John GPC doesn’t say I can’t do this. Right. Exactly. The thing
⏹️ ▶️ John about this feature, we’re like, how is this going to manifest? How are they going to present it? The fact is
⏹️ ▶️ John they don’t have anything like this. Now, if they did have something like this, how would they use it? We
⏹️ ▶️ John don’t know because they don’t have anything like this, but but basically you talk to Siri and
⏹️ ▶️ John I’m sure it doesn’t say I can’t do this.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco What does is
⏹️ ▶️ John helpfully offer hey do you want me to send this to chat GPT as if people know what the hell
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco I do right people know
⏹️ ▶️ John and you could say yes or you can say no and if you say yes, it will do it and it will bring it back and they’re really sort
⏹️ ▶️ John of isolating it to lay the blame and I was kind of surprised when they said and by the way will you
⏹️ ▶️ John this may work with other things besides chat GPT in the future. They they even named Google Gemini.
⏹️ ▶️ John They said you know Google Gemini. We were talking with them and the rumors that you read now they didn’t say this, but they said hey we
⏹️ ▶️ John may you know we may integrate with other third party large language models. What they
⏹️ ▶️ John didn’t say is we’re also internally working to make our model as good as theirs so we can use it. They do have
⏹️ ▶️ John their own models. They’re using everything we’ve talked about so far is Apple’s own models running an Apple’s own servers
⏹️ ▶️ John on Apple’s own device and they emphasize this in the keynote that’s just just to be clear everything you’ve seen it’s
⏹️ ▶️ John us. It’s all us. It’s privacy preserving. But then they didn’t say this. We don’t have we don’t
⏹️ ▶️ John have this. There’s a thing we don’t have that we know people are interested in and we wanted to provide access to it and the way they’re
⏹️ ▶️ John doing it is sometimes when you talk to Siri, it’s just that you talk to somebody else.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep. And so they will go to chat. You pt. This will do composition image generation.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey No account required. It’s free. Uh there’s nothing logged. Uh subscriber
⏹️ ▶️ Casey chat. You pt subscribers can actually connect their account to get more paid features, et cetera, et cetera. They said,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you’re in control of when chat GPT is used. It’s coming later this year, and support for other AI models in
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the future. And so basically, that’s AI for the rest of us,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey as they said. iPhone 15 Pro and iPad and Mac with M1 or later. US English this summer.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Everyone else, pound sand for the time being.
⏹️ ▶️ John And iPad M1 and later. Sorry,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco yes. Yeah. This is pretty great. I mean, I think we need to wrap up because we’re going to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco run longer. I’m very happy with what they’ve announced today. I think
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it is exactly the kind of thing we would expect from Apple, and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco kind of at the top of what we would expect from Apple. It’s not underwhelming. There’s no
⏹️ ▶️ Marco major limitations or compromises that we can see yet. I think it just looks like a really solid set of updates, and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I like that where they’re going with their AI features does seem to be
⏹️ ▶️ Marco exactly in line with both what we would expect from Apple and what we would hope from Apple. So
⏹️ ▶️ Marco overall, we’ll see over the coming months as we dive into the APIs and see what the limitations are.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And then as we actually get to use these betas, we’ll see where the rough edges still are or what features aren’t there
⏹️ ▶️ Marco yet. But overall, as a way for them to have set the direction, I’m very happy with what this is.
⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah. All these things are still subject to, OK, well, we have to actually try to use them. Because the things they describe
⏹️ ▶️ John are great until we see what answers they give them. But with these sort of AI LLM things, that’s the big question.
⏹️ ▶️ John Will it do a good job? We like how it’s set up. We like, as I said, the architecture and their private clouds
⏹️ ▶️ John and the privacy preserving. And we like how it integrates. And we like everything about it. But the bottom line is you’re going
⏹️ ▶️ John to get a result. Is the result useful? Does it get it wrong? Like this has always been the problem with
⏹️ ▶️ John Siri. Siri ostensibly can do a bunch of things, but often you ask it to do them and it can’t do them. Will it be
⏹️ ▶️ John consistent more than Siri is? Will it be faster? Like these are all things that we’ll find out when we start running
⏹️ ▶️ John the betas and see how it works out. But the architecture and the arrangement and the selection of features they’ve
⏹️ ▶️ John laid out all look good. It’s just a question of execution now, and we hope they do that well.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yep. All right. Thank you to our sponsors this week, Trade Coffee and Delete Me.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And thank you especially to our members. You support us directly. We are so thankful for that.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco You can join atp.fm slash join. What are we doing for overtime this week?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I think we’re going to be talking about the Apple Park WWDC experience, which I’m very excited
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to talk about everything except maybe the food will be in overtime. We’ll probably
⏹️ ▶️ Casey give everyone the food stuff in just
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco a moment. So
⏹️ ▶️ Marco overtime is our member exclusive segment. You can join and listen at ATV.FM slash join. Thank you so much everyone
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and we’ll talk to you next week.
Ending theme
⏹️ ▶️ John Now the show is over, they didn’t even mean to begin Cause
⏹️ ▶️ John accidental John didn’t do any research, Marco and
⏹️ ▶️ John Casey wouldn’t let him Cause it was accidental, oh
⏹️ ▶️ John it was accidental And you can find the show notes at atp.fm
⏹️ ▶️ John And if you’re into Mastodon, you can follow them at
⏹️ ▶️ Marco C-A-S-E-Y-L-I-S-S So that’s Casey Liss, M-A-R-C-O-A-R-M,
⏹️ ▶️ John S-I-R-A-C-U-S-A Syracuse So John,
⏹️ ▶️ John how was the WWDC food?
⏹️ ▶️ John to talk about the WWDC box lunches.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey Yeah. They would be
⏹️ ▶️ John big convention centers and the convention centers very often have contracts that require
⏹️ ▶️ John Apple to use their vendor for food that you serve people. So they had to use those
⏹️ ▶️ John vendors and that food was often exciting and surprising
⏹️ ▶️ John soggy and strange and just the source of lots of conversations. This was my first
⏹️ ▶️ John WC at Apple Park, even though they’ve done it here for a couple years. It was Casey’s first as well.
⏹️ ▶️ John They did not have box launches. Apple is not required to use some weird vendor for their food. In fact, they can
⏹️ ▶️ John do whatever they want. It’s their food. It’s in Apple the whole park and I have to say not that this is a high
⏹️ ▶️ John bar, but this was the best wvc food I have ever had not even close. It’s
⏹️ ▶️ John nothing like the box lunches. You see it was better than most catered food
⏹️ ▶️ John at any kind of office conference thing you’re going to see. It was interesting. It was executed pretty well. They didn’t
⏹️ ▶️ John have many items that were ill advised, like
⏹️ ▶️ John like an ice cream sundae and they leave it out in the sun for an There’s some food items that will work
⏹️ ▶️ John better in a context where you have to put out large volumes of it out for people. Now, I will say that I was with
⏹️ ▶️ John the media people in a smaller area. I don’t know if the attendees got different food than we did, but the media area
⏹️ ▶️ John had maybe 100 or 200 people versus 5,000 attendees. Well, no, it’s not 5,000 anymore,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey right? No, I think it’s like 1,500 or something. I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco don’t know. It seems
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like a lot. But anyway, there’s a lot more. And so maybe
⏹️ ▶️ John the food was different down there. But yeah, they had a selection. I don’t even think they called it pizza.
⏹️ ▶️ John I think they called it like focaccia with tomato sauce and cheese on top with basil,
⏹️ ▶️ John and that’s what it was
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco and I have to say it was not pizza.
⏹️ ▶️ John It didn’t I mean it looked it would look like it was pretending to be Sicilian pizza, but what it tasted like was
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey tomato sauce
⏹️ ▶️ John mozzarella, but it was for for what it was. I give it a thumbs up. I
⏹️ ▶️ John it was it tasted didn’t taste like pizza, but it tastes like a good food item that I want to eat right
⏹️ ▶️ John and that’s what it’s got to do and they had this little thing with like the pork belly on a cornbread
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey thing. That was really good too. Yeah. The
⏹️ ▶️ John hell that wasn’t like thumbs up on that too. And
⏹️ ▶️ Casey because it was like a slab of thick cut bacon basically, because that’s what pork belly basically is and or vice versa
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and a little piece of cornbread and like a little sliver of jalapeno. That was really good. They had some sort of fish like
⏹️ ▶️ Casey sandwich thing. Yeah, I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John didn’t bring the fish. You know, I wouldn’t go for the, it was really
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John actually really, really good for seconds.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey You got a second one of those
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and actually breakfast was really good to come to think of it. They had little
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco sandwiches. Great overnight
⏹️ ▶️ Casey oats thing at breakfast. I didn’t have that, but I had, they had a little breakfast sandwiches that were like egg and bacon whatever those really
⏹️ ▶️ John little mini slide like I got one with like eggplant on and some other stuff some pickled peppers and eggplant just I mean
⏹️ ▶️ John it wasn’t you know it’s not high cuisine and you could tell some of it you know it’s been out for a while and some of the pickled peppers
⏹️ ▶️ John did soak into like the kind of hot dog bunny type, but I’m not saying it’s amazing great food, but boy
⏹️ ▶️ Casey those box nightings day.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John Oh my gosh so
⏹️ ▶️ Casey much better there was something else that I oh I saw you grab a little like cup of salad
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and I’m really allergic to spinach and so I’m always a little like I love salad, but I’m always a little reluctant
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to, you know, brave that in this sort of scenario. But I looked and they had the ingredients there because California,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I guess, but hey, it worked out in my favor and and I had that and it had all sorts of of ingredients that
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I don’t typically eat, but it was very, very tasty. So I enjoyed their vegetables.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco Oh, stop. I have salads all the time.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, the chocolate chip cookie. They had little
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco packages. Chocolate chip cookie was pretty good.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, even even the touch screen coffee was actually pretty good.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John Like I have one of those
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like, like you know touch screens. You push what you want and it just very slowly trips it out. This very fancy looking faucet, but
⏹️ ▶️ Marco even that was actually like okay, which I was not expecting it to be. Yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ John complaint is that they had water just you know water bottles there and to try to be environmentally better.
⏹️ ▶️ John They didn’t have plastic water bottles. They had like aluminum water bottles. The caps on those aluminum water
⏹️ ▶️ John bottles are so hard to get off
⏹️ ▶️ Casey way too. I have one right here. It’s fine.
⏹️ ▶️ John Just the initial thing where you have to break the little
⏹️ ▶️ John connecting. That’s what I mean not once it’s open, it’s fine. I
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco got you. You got
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to do some strength training on that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John your wrist action. I know,
⏹️ ▶️ John but it’s just I mean I got them open. It’s not but it was just it’s harder than it should have been. So there’s one design
⏹️ ▶️ John problem with those with those bottles. But yeah, again, the bar is low. You’re not expecting much, but
⏹️ ▶️ John pleasantly surprised, you know, it’s as you would expect the Apple Park food. I’m sure people who work there it
⏹️ ▶️ John just like it’s like work cafeteria food,
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey but I think it was
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John Oh, yeah, no, it’s all the same.
⏹️ ▶️ John That’s what you get if you work there, but
⏹️ ▶️ John is is it having eaten it a lot of a company cafeteria
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey is in my career.
⏹️ ▶️ John This is a step up from any place I have ever worked.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Have you ever been to any of the cafe max ever ever ever?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey okay, so because we went like in twenty
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco seven. Honestly, I’ve always been very pleased with them. Yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’ve gone to a few here and there, like over different years and different buildings and you know different people giving us lunches and stuff
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and it’s always been
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, I was very impressed with the food. It gave it two thumbs up for me.