Unofficial Accidental Tech Podcast transcripts (generated by computer, so expect errors).

498: Not MagSafe, but MagSafe

Wishes and expectations for next week’s Apple event, and exit interviews for the outgoing iPhone and Apple Watch.

Episode Description:

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Transcribed using Whisper large_v2 (transcription) + WAV2VEC2_ASR_LARGE_LV60K_960H (alignment) + Pyannote (speaker diaritization).


  1. ⚠️ Low toner
  2. Donate to St. Jude
  3. Lens polarizers and clear filters
  4. Sponsor: Kolide
  5. Rock Band audio-sync calibration
  6. Exit Interview: Series 7
  7. Sponsor: Trade Coffee
  8. Exit Interview: iPhone 13 Pro
  9. Sponsor: Squarespace (code ATP)
  10. iPhone 14 rumors
  11. Apple Watch Series 8 rumors
  12. AirPods Pro rumors
  13. AR rumors
  14. Special ending theme
  15. Post-show

⚠️ Low toner

⏹️ ▶️ Marco So I think I’ve leveled up as a nerd.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John Oh?

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I have, for I think the first time ever, replaced a toner

⏹️ ▶️ Marco cartridge on a home laser printer in my house.

⏹️ ▶️ John Now, is the leveling up having to do with you performing the task, as in, look at what I did, I changed

⏹️ ▶️ John my own oil, or is the leveling up owning a laser printer long enough to use up all the toner?

⏹️ ▶️ Marco The latter. I so you know I’m I know I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco know all the you know millenniums out there like I don’t even need a printer okay I need printers like that’s just

⏹️ ▶️ Marco my life and I don’t know how anybody doesn’t but anyway I have always been a fan of laser printers

⏹️ ▶️ Marco ever since I discovered them and ever since they became affordable which was I’d say around like 2001 2002 like they started getting

⏹️ ▶️ Marco those like sub few hundred dollar ones that were just black and white and like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco from brother or whatever and they were really good anyway over time I have I have moved on eventually to color

⏹️ ▶️ Marco lasers. And my favorite color laser is this giant HP enterprise 500

⏹️ ▶️ Marco series thing I have in Westchester that is just massive and amazing. And it’s

⏹️ ▶️ Marco what I love about it is that you just hit print and you walk over to the printer and the time you arrive, it’s there,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it’s done. Like I’ve, there’s no, there’s no warmup time. There’s no like, let me spin for a while and make some noises. Cause

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m an Epson thing. Like none of that stuff. You literally just hit print on your computer, get up, walk over to the printer

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and it’s sitting there in the tray ready to go. I love that. But here at the beach, my office is

⏹️ ▶️ Marco quite small and I don’t have a location that I can put a giant color laser printer.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco So

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey I have a tiny one,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco this little HP M182NW. And through a combination

⏹️ ▶️ Marco of me not being able to fit a bigger printer that I actually want, and right now printers

⏹️ ▶️ Marco are insanely expensive. Like I don’t know if you’ve shopped recently for printers. I know John, you had one not too long ago,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco But printers ever since COVID printers, especially the kind of

⏹️ ▶️ Marco printer that somebody might want for a home office, which tends to lean more towards low end lasers,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco especially with built in scanners. The that category is has been

⏹️ ▶️ Marco expensive and hard to find for two years. And so and especially the one

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I have, like, I happen to look out and caught it like for list price, you know, two years ago when I was

⏹️ ▶️ Marco when I was sitting at this office. And I’m very lucky I did because it’s been out of stock for most of that time, or

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it’s been, you know, grossly overpriced on like, you know, scraper sites.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey So it’s it’s available right now for $660 on Amazon. Oh my

⏹️ ▶️ Marco God. Well, the the actual price is some people have it in stock for its actual current list price of about $470, which I think I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco paid $300 for two years ago. But

⏹️ ▶️ Marco a set of new toners is only $200. dollars. And so

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I actually needed all four like all four running low and I lasted a long

⏹️ ▶️ Marco time of ignoring its warnings because when laser printers tell you their toner is low they

⏹️ ▶️ Marco don’t actually know. All they’re doing is keeping a page count.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Usually, this is a hot tip, you can just keep printing unless it has some kind of you know lockout where eventually it’ll just

⏹️ ▶️ Marco refuse which most of them don’t. You can just keep printing until you start seeing like gaps in your

⏹️ ▶️ Marco printout and that’s when you know you have to do something. Now what you need to do might just be taking

⏹️ ▶️ Marco out the cartridge and shaking it side to side a little bit and then putting it back and you can usually get a bit more time out of it that

⏹️ ▶️ Marco way but eventually you’d actually do have to replace it but it’s usually long

⏹️ ▶️ Marco after it tells you you have to replace it but I actually finally have printed enough pages on this printer

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and because it’s a small printer it has a very tiny capacity toner cartridges

⏹️ ▶️ Marco so that combination I finally had to replace the toner cartridges and

⏹️ ▶️ Marco because of the crazy printer situation right now it is not worth just buying a new printer which it often previous

⏹️ ▶️ Marco to COVID it often was just cheaper to do that.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Which is so sad.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco It really is. It’s either

⏹️ ▶️ Casey here or there. I’m very proud of you, Marco.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey A lot of you are gonna buy iPhones soon, and that is a lot of money.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey And you know what you can do with some of that money, especially if you have a little extra laying around? What can you do with that, Marco?

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Well, you can waste it on electronics that you vaguely need, or

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey you can

⏹️ ▶️ Marco actually use it to literally help kids with cancer. First of all, to

⏹️ ▶️ Marco have research done to prevent that cancer in the first place. Then, to have a hospital

⏹️ ▶️ Marco that Americans, and because they’re Americans they have terrible health care options, can go to to

⏹️ ▶️ Marco have their child’s cancer treated and they never pay a dime?

⏹️ ▶️ Marco That’s a pretty great cause. St. Jude does amazing work in this area and we are very

⏹️ ▶️ Marco happy to join our friends at Relay in their September campaign to support them.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Whatever your particular financial situation is, as much as we joke about buying new phones and we’re gonna be talking about new phones soon,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey if you have even but a dollar to throw in the direction of Memphis, Tennessee, specifically to St. Jude,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey please consider donating. You can go to, that’s S-T-J-U-D-E dot org slash

⏹️ ▶️ Casey A-T-P, and you can very quickly and very easily go ahead and donate there. And

⏹️ ▶️ Casey this is something that the three of us have been involved with for several years now. We are all very close

⏹️ ▶️ Casey with Stephen Hackett. Stephen Hackett is the co-founder of RelayFM, and his eldest child,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey his son, was, and to some degree still is, a patient of St. Jude and his

⏹️ ▶️ Casey son Josiah’s life was saved by St. Jude. Like I don’t think this is

⏹️ ▶️ Casey up for grabs. I don’t think this is up for debate. This is what happened. For St. Jude to do that

⏹️ ▶️ Casey and to not charge his family a cent is bananas. And I know if you live in

⏹️ ▶️ Casey a civilized country, this sounds utterly depressing because it is, but America

⏹️ ▶️ Casey for all its good parts has a lot of bad parts and one of the bad parts is healthcare. I can assure you it is financially ruinous

⏹️ ▶️ Casey to go through a devastating illness like this, even with insurance. And so for St.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Jude to say to a family, look, this is possibly the darkest days of your entire

⏹️ ▶️ Casey lives, we will take a small part of that and make it better. We will not charge you a cent.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey We will try to do everything in our power to fix your child and to help them survive

⏹️ ▶️ Casey and thrive. It’s a really phenomenal thing. And this has been going on for 60 years.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey They opened their doors in 1962. And what’s great about St. Jude is that it’s not just

⏹️ ▶️ Casey St. Jude Children’s Hospital, it’s St. Jude Children’s Research Hospital. And so, because

⏹️ ▶️ Casey of treatments that have been developed at St. Jude, the worldwide childhood cancer survival rate has gone

⏹️ ▶️ Casey from about 20% to more than 80%. Now, that’s not exclusively St. Jude, but it’s a lot St. Jude. So, even if

⏹️ ▶️ Casey you live in a civilized country, where you don’t have to worry as much about money and things like

⏹️ ▶️ Casey that when it comes to illness, you still have to worry about fixing the illness. And St. Jude has

⏹️ ▶️ Casey done incredible and immense things to help cure childhood cancer. And hey,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey you could spend a bunch of money on a phone that you’ll throw away in a year or two, or you could help cure childhood cancer.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey You make the choice. What do you think is best? So John, what is our plan for the three of us? What are we doing this year?

⏹️ ▶️ John So normally, we try to make Casey do a hasty donation while he’s in the middle of

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco recording another podcast. And then he

⏹️ ▶️ John yells at us and accidentally puts an asterisk in the name. We’re not quite sure how we’re going to make Casey donate this

⏹️ ▶️ John year, but. No, stop. We discussed it before the show. We said, we’re not going to rush you to do

⏹️ ▶️ John it now, but we don’t actually know when. But anyway, we collectively, as the three hosts of ATP, will be donating $21,000

⏹️ ▶️ John to St. Jude this year. One of us will probably try to be a jerk and

⏹️ ▶️ John add $1 more than

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco the other members. We’ll see how that works

⏹️ ▶️ John out. We haven’t actually pushed the button at the time of the recording, but we will be doing that. We are trying to model good behavior

⏹️ ▶️ John for you, our wonderful listeners. So please be generous. Think about how much money you’re going to spend on your phone.

⏹️ ▶️ John And I’m going to say, just buy both. That’s the Marco approach. Don’t pick one or the other. Buy a ridiculously

⏹️ ▶️ John expensive phone, buy the really expensive first party Apple case, and also donate a ton of money

⏹️ ▶️ John to St. Jude because that’s what September is all about.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, so my usual pitch is, many of us are about to, sometime

⏹️ ▶️ Marco this holiday season or this fall, and possibly even next week, drop some

⏹️ ▶️ Marco money on some tech. Whatever Apple’s gonna release, we’re gonna figure out reasons why we have to have it, and we’re

⏹️ ▶️ Marco gonna get something. whether you’re getting the iPhone or the Apple Watch, or later

⏹️ ▶️ Marco on in the fall, maybe you’re gonna get a new iPad or a new Mac, or whatever it is, you’re gonna be spending some money

⏹️ ▶️ Marco on tech this fall, in all likelihood, if you listen to this show. When that happens, you might have to spend like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco seven or $800 or more on something. And a lot of times, you get these add-ons at the end. And that

⏹️ ▶️ Marco add-on might be something like a case. Oh, there’s another 60 bucks or whatever. Or if it’s an iPad,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco maybe a new smart cover or a new keyboard, that’s $100 or more. And at the end,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco you might have to throw on, oh, let’s throw on some AppleCare, that’s another $100. Oh, sales tax, that’s another $100. Get whatever

⏹️ ▶️ Marco those little increments are that you kind of just do at the end

⏹️ ▶️ Marco because you have to or it’s an accessory charge or whatever. You can donate at least that much

⏹️ ▶️ Marco to Sanchud. Because if that’s how you’re looking at the purchase, oh, I’m gonna get a $700 phone. Well,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco actually, it’s gonna be, you know, an $800 phone once I get the capacity I want or more.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco And then, oh, and then it’s gonna be, you know, actually wants them at the door with AppleCare in a case, it’s gonna be 1200 bucks.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco You know what, you can give Sanju 200 bucks. And so whatever you can do, if your budget is not that high,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco give him 20 bucks, give him 50 bucks, whatever you can do, that’s up to you, with your

⏹️ ▶️ Marco abilities and your priorities there, that’s up to you, but we ask that you at least give them something. Because

⏹️ ▶️ Marco giving them something is better than giving them nothing, and whatever you can give, whether it’s five bucks, 10

⏹️ ▶️ Marco bucks, or 5000 bucks, That’s fantastic, good for you, it’s a great cause, and we

⏹️ ▶️ Marco hope you do.

⏹️ ▶️ John What did we do last year for the top donor? I remember we made a-

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco I believe

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Casey visited their house and made them a Velveeta Chelsin cheese. That

⏹️ ▶️ John would happen. We had the thing last year where if someone can beat ATP with our $21,000 donation,

⏹️ ▶️ John if they become the new top donor, topping us, we’re just competing,

⏹️ ▶️ John the competition’s just between ATP and ATP’s listeners. There’s probably other people who are in the mix that you’re not competing

⏹️ ▶️ John with or whatever. We talked about them on the show, but did they get anything?

⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey I don’t remember.

⏹️ ▶️ John Stickers, they got stickers.

⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey Oh, there we go. Do

⏹️ ▶️ John you still have stickers left? Are we doing that again?

⏹️ ▶️ Casey I am happy to do that again, and I do have stickers left. However, I do have a limited quantity

⏹️ ▶️ Casey of stickers left. I should probably print some more. I can look, if you let me step away from the mic and dig up the stickers

⏹️ ▶️ Casey and figure out how many I have, but suffice it to say, it would behoove you to do a lot of donating and donating

⏹️ ▶️ Casey it quickly. Now, you don’t have to say, oh, this is for ATP and the notes or anything like that. just send me an

⏹️ ▶️ Casey email or figure out a way to contact me. Send me something on Twitter. It’s not about ATP versus Relay or anything

⏹️ ▶️ Casey like that. It’s just about raising money to cure childhood. Oh,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco stop it. It’s about raising money

⏹️ ▶️ Casey for childhood cancer. So please, please.

⏹️ ▶️ John Raising money with

⏹️ ▶️ Marco some

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John competition.

⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah, this kind of competition helps people to donate more. So if you want to be talked about, if

⏹️ ▶️ John you want us to try to mangle your name as we try to pronounce it on ATP and then apologize profusely and then get a sticker

⏹️ ▶️ John from Casey if he still has some left, All you got to do is donate $21,000 and one cent. Or more. You never know.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey You never know. What if I donate, what is it, $7,010? I know. Yeah,

⏹️ ▶️ John you do have to wait until we actually do our donations because Casey sometimes shoves in a couple extra

⏹️ ▶️ Marco bucks. Doesn’t it work for anybody who just beats us individually? Because we do it as three individual $7,000

⏹️ ▶️ Marco donations. Okay,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey so here’s the thing. I think that was the case last year, but we had some utterly

⏹️ ▶️ Casey bananas donations last year. So I will put the challenge out. Okay, here’s your competition. We’re not competing

⏹️ ▶️ Casey with Relay. Here’s your competition. Can you, the listener, beat the three of us as

⏹️ ▶️ Casey a collective? So, no stickers for you. That’s a

⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco high bar. I’m serious.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey This is what

⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco happened last week. I would say

⏹️ ▶️ Marco anybody who beats the $7,000, they should get stickers.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John What we’ll have to do is wait until

⏹️ ▶️ John the whole thing is over and then see what the top X donors are

⏹️ ▶️ John and see how many stickers we have and figure it out from there. Because we’re not trying to make this like, Obviously, most people

⏹️ ▶️ John can’t give that much money, right? So give $1. That’s what I want

⏹️ ▶️ John you to do. Give $5, give $20. That’s great. But for the very, very wealthy individuals who are listening to this and

⏹️ ▶️ John who are taking our advice on what to do with their six-figure super hyper cars and stuff,

⏹️ ▶️ John and their ATV members at the top level, which is exactly the same as the bottom level,

⏹️ ▶️ John they might, I mean, it happened last year. People donated a huge amount of money. So I don’t want to discourage those people. Very wealthy people,

⏹️ ▶️ John go on. Do the very wealthy person thing, and you may get a sticker worth probably at least 10 cents.

⏹️ ▶️ John Maybe 50.

⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey Maybe 50 cents. The sticker may

⏹️ ▶️ John be worth as much as the stamp that Casey uses to

⏹️ ▶️ Marco mail it. That’s true. And you can put the 10 cent sticker on your hyper car. That makes total sense.

⏹️ ▶️ John That’s right. Just peel it off and put it on the window of your Ferrari, and it’ll look great until it inevitably

⏹️ ▶️ John wears off and the glue dies because it’s like a 10 cent sticker.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey John, let me tell you a little secret, just between the three of us. I actually sent a couple

⏹️ ▶️ Casey of stickers to the big donors. It was more than one. It was like two, maybe even four. I think that somebody

⏹️ ▶️ Casey donated more than $20,000 might have even gotten like

⏹️ ▶️ John six. It was a raid array of stickers. That’s why we had no stickers left. It was sticker inflation. You gotta

⏹️ ▶️ John be sending these people six stickers. You gotta think about the future ones. You know we can’t actually make any more stickers.

⏹️ ▶️ John We’ve lost the technology for sticker making. Yep, that’s right.

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco think if somebody actually donates like $21,001,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think they can get like a pack of stickers at that point. What is a pack of stickers? Like 10 bucks.

⏹️ ▶️ John you can give them Marco’s old toner cartridge. We’ll think of

⏹️ ▶️ Marco something. No, it’s already gone. I don’t have enough room in this office to keep spares around.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Well, actually, if you really want to go nuts, this is going way off the rails. The speakers that you

⏹️ ▶️ Casey sent to me and gifted me, I never ended up doing anything with them because then I immediately got the studio display

⏹️ ▶️ Casey right after and that was sufficient for my purposes. So you can have third-hand Marco speakers

⏹️ ▶️ Casey if you’re in the continental United

⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John States.

⏹️ ▶️ John That sounds more like a curse gift. Right? I think

⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey I’m kidding. I think I’m kidding. I think you gotta buy a receiver to connect them to, and

⏹️ ▶️ Casey it’s the whole thing. I think I’m kidding, but we’ll see. If you donate like $30,000, we’ll talk. And CMF

⏹️ ▶️ Casey in the chat said, you know, would you send whoever the top donor is an apple pie as made by Aaron,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey because Aaron makes some of the world’s best apple pies. I don’t think that’s really feasible, but I like where your head’s at.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey And if you really do donate tens and tens of thousands of dollars, let’s see what we can figure out. No guarantees

⏹️ ▶️ Casey on anything. I don’t think you can ship

⏹️ ▶️ John food in the mail like that. I don’t think it would survive or be- Maybe

⏹️ ▶️ Casey we’ll send the recipe, I don’t know. You’re gonna send the recipe? I

⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John don’t know, man.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey I’m just working with you. Play with me in the space

⏹️ ▶️ John here. It’s like the display postscript of food prizes.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Well, actually, you know, here’s what, if we get $100,000 donation, will you send them a pasta sauce recipe? I’ll

⏹️ ▶️ Casey put you on the spot.

⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah, sure.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey For $100,000, you get a John’s. That’s not

⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John gonna

⏹️ ▶️ John happen, but

⏹️ ▶️ Casey yeah, I will. Oh no, challenge accepted, but not for me. I mean, nobody wants

⏹️ ▶️ John it, but yeah.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey You heard it here first, $100,000 donation, you get John’s pasta sauce recipe, which you may not share with anyone. That’s part of the deal.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey You may not share it with anyone, but you can have it.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco And however you make it, it will be wrong.

⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah, that’s also true. Merlin made it and he said he liked it, then he never made it again because it’s just too much work.

⏹️ ▶️ John And he made it wrong. No, he made it

⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey fine,

⏹️ ▶️ John as far as I know.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Oh my goodness. All right. It’s so complicated. In any case, please, please, please, all kidding aside,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey and really and truly, as much as we’re joking about the big ticket donors, honest to goodness,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey the fundraising is not about the $1,000 donation, the $10,000 donation, the $100,000 donation to get John’s pasta sauce recipe.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey It’s about the $10 and $20 and $30 donations. If you’re a student

⏹️ ▶️ Casey and you can only send a few bucks, send a few bucks, feel good about yourself. There’s nothing wrong with that. So please,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey you’re gonna hear this a few more times. You’ll hear it all through September, but please, please, please consider going to

⏹️ ▶️ Casey slash ATP. Nobody’s making you, you don’t have to, but if you have a few dollars to send

⏹️ ▶️ Casey their way, it would make the three of us and kids sick with cancer

⏹️ ▶️ Casey very, very happy. So please think about it. All right.

Lens polarizers and clear filters

⏹️ ▶️ Casey We have a surprisingly short amount to follow up this week. John, can you tell me about your polarizer

⏹️ ▶️ Casey and your lens protector?

⏹️ ▶️ John It’s something new I did this year, and I was reminded when I was going through a bunch of my camera junk on my shelf that I actually

⏹️ ▶️ John did this back when I got my first like Sony a6300, my first interchangeable

⏹️ ▶️ John lens camera. I had bought, I don’t know, like a clear lens protector that like

⏹️ ▶️ John screws onto the front of the lens to protect it from things hitting it or scratches and stuff like that.

⏹️ ▶️ John And I never really used it. Like, I didn’t even remember that I had it until I found it up on the shelf. I’m like, oh yeah,

⏹️ ▶️ John I remember when I got this and I guess I didn’t use it. And I think why I didn’t use it was, after I

⏹️ ▶️ John bought it, I don’t even know why I bought it, it was probably suggested to me as like, other people bought this, you know, whatever. People

⏹️ ▶️ John were saying, oh, you shouldn’t put that on there because with an APS-C camera like

⏹️ ▶️ John that, you need all the light you can get to the sensor. And even though these things are ostensibly clear, sometimes they

⏹️ ▶️ John cut down the amount of light that goes in, especially if they’re not so good and plus you can get glare and reflections and

⏹️ ▶️ John there were naysayers, let’s say. I was like, oh, I don’t want any of that and I need all the light I can

⏹️ ▶️ John get so you know, I won’t use this thing. But when I went on my recent

⏹️ ▶️ John Long Island vacation I’d totally forgotten about that, but I was looking through, you

⏹️ ▶️ John know, lens stuff and I was getting suggested to me by

⏹️ ▶️ John various e-commerce sites polarizers and clear lens protectors. Clear lens

⏹️ ▶️ John protectors I was interested in because I had just bought, thanks to Margo’s curse gift, a very very expensive

⏹️ ▶️ John lens and that I didn’t want to get scratched. And I’m like okay well if I get

⏹️ ▶️ John a clear lens cover that will help protect it. And I watched some YouTube videos about that

⏹️ ▶️ John like yeah the clear ones are pretty good and it’s way cheaper to replace them than

⏹️ ▶️ John it is to you know try to replace a lens that has a scratch on I was kind

⏹️ ▶️ John of surprised at how expensive a clear piece of whatever the heck it is that screws onto your lens can possibly

⏹️ ▶️ John be. But I’m like, it’s that the floor mats effect where you’re buying a $30,000 car and $150 for floor mats doesn’t

⏹️ ▶️ John seem so bad, right? When if you were just buying floor mats by themselves and they were $150, you’d be like, what? Although my prices are

⏹️ ▶️ John out of date, I should probably say like $500 above the whole floor mats cost now.

⏹️ ▶️ John So I was considering that. And also, in the same sort of

⏹️ ▶️ John genre of suggested products, were polarizers, which is the thing you put on

⏹️ ▶️ John the lens of your camera that is, it’s like polarized sunglasses that cuts down on

⏹️ ▶️ John light whose wavelength is, what is it? It’s not the wavelength, it’s the cut down light

⏹️ ▶️ John with the direction of the waves lines up in a certain way, right? And so I actually decided

⏹️ ▶️ John to get both of those things. I got the clear protective lens for my very expensive

⏹️ ▶️ John lens that I was gonna use, like the, you know, my just sort of everyday lens that I was gonna use for people sitting on

⏹️ ▶️ John the beach towel and people back at the house and stuff like that. And then I got a polarizer from my long lens for people

⏹️ ▶️ John out in the ocean, because you do get a lot of glare and reflections off of the ocean. And when I got the polarizer,

⏹️ ▶️ John I was kind of surprised to see that it didn’t have any markings on it. So the way a polarizer works is, you know, I

⏹️ ▶️ John don’t know if you’ve ever done this with like pieces of LCD or whatever, but

⏹️ ▶️ John you twist it and when you twist it in one direction, it’s

⏹️ ▶️ John basically clear, not really, it cuts down some light, but it’s basically clear. It’s not doing anything polarizing.

⏹️ ▶️ John And when you twist it, I think 90 degrees, that’s maximum polarized filtering where

⏹️ ▶️ John it will cancel out the light waves that are aligned in a particular direction, right? But

⏹️ ▶️ John there’s nothing on the little thing that says, this position is off and this position is on

⏹️ ▶️ John and all the positions in between. Like, well, maybe they don’t put the markings because it’s so obvious when you look through the lens,

⏹️ ▶️ John which direction it is. And for me, it was kind of like the lip sync thing. It was not obvious. I had to go out

⏹️ ▶️ John to my car on my driveway on a sunny day, look through the

⏹️ ▶️ John viewfinder and twist the thing. And then you would see, okay, I see the highlights, the reflections of

⏹️ ▶️ John the sun bouncing off my car. The twist, twist, twist, ah, they’ve kind of almost disappeared. Then twist, twist, ah,

⏹️ ▶️ John they’re back. And so doing that, I figured out where the sort of, as best as I could judge where

⏹️ ▶️ John the maximum effect was and where the off position was. But still no markings on the filter,

⏹️ ▶️ John which is really weird. And both of those, both the clear one that I put on my expensive lens and the polarizer

⏹️ ▶️ John that I put on my long lens, very expensive. Very expensive for a circular

⏹️ ▶️ John thing. And I guess, I mean, I did a lot of research and reviews of them. I guess

⏹️ ▶️ John there can be such a thing as a bad one in terms of reflections and how much light they let through

⏹️ ▶️ John and just general sturdiness and reliability and getting stuck on the lens and you know,

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco is there one?

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Well, because if you think about it, like you’re adding another layer of glass. And so there’s a lot of

⏹️ ▶️ Marco different qualities of optical glass and their coatings and their treatments and whatever they’re being

⏹️ ▶️ Marco held in by. And you know, so it kind of makes sense when you think about it that way, like you’re adding

⏹️ ▶️ Marco kind of like another lens in a way, like, you know, another glass element. And so

⏹️ ▶️ Marco there are lots of ways to make okay glass for okay prices, but if you want really

⏹️ ▶️ Marco good glass that your incredible camera sensor can see through it with clarity and not have distortions or reflections

⏹️ ▶️ Marco or whatever else, yeah, okay, that actually could be a fairly high-end,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco precisely manufactured thing. I mean, so was this by any chance the B&W brand? That’s always

⏹️ ▶️ Marco what I bought.

⏹️ ▶️ John What did I get? No, I think my polarizer was like Polartec or something and the clear one,

⏹️ ▶️ John I forget the brand of the clear one. Like I was trying to price control on the clear one. And

⏹️ ▶️ John was

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the clear one technically a quote UV and haze filter?

⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah, they always say that they’re UV filters or whatever. Like I can look up the brands and I’ll

⏹️ ▶️ John put the links in the show notes, but they were both over $100. Like I think I brought lenses that were less expensive than this

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco polarizer. Yeah, I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco mean, for like a B&W UV haze, that’s usually like 80 bucks. And I think the polarizer is usually like a 150 or something

⏹️ ▶️ Marco like that. And in that

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John range, it depends how big they are.

⏹️ ▶️ John They’re they’re they’re expensive. And the other the other kind of filter people mentioning the chat is a neutral

⏹️ ▶️ John neutral density filter and ND filter that’s basically just to cut down the amount on the amount of light that’s going in uh

⏹️ ▶️ John to your camera in fact some cinema cameras have uh have ND filters like inside the body that you can

⏹️ ▶️ John swap between it’s such a common thing uh the main reason i thought the polarizer would be useful as i said if you’re taking

⏹️ ▶️ John pictures of people in the waves at the ocean on a sunny day there’s lots of glare off the water in the

⏹️ ▶️ John ocean right you know especially like the tips of waves and you know there are lots of curling water shapes

⏹️ ▶️ John that are going to potentially reflect a lot of water into the camera lens. Now those

⏹️ ▶️ John reflections, it’s not like they’re necessarily bad, it really depends on what you’re going for. So if

⏹️ ▶️ John you look at a lot of the sort of tutorials about polarizing filters, they show a lot of things like landscape photography, let’s say

⏹️ ▶️ John you’re taking a picture of this river and the mountains in the background,

⏹️ ▶️ John and all you’re getting, all you can see in the river because it’s very still, is just a reflection of the sky, but if you put a polarizing

⏹️ ▶️ John filter So now you can actually see the river and the ripples in the water and the stones in it. And that’s kind of an artistic choice

⏹️ ▶️ John because like maybe I want the reflection of the sky and maybe I like that’s not something I want to cut out.

⏹️ ▶️ John But if you’re trying to, for example, take a picture of the clear river showing the stones under the water

⏹️ ▶️ John and all you can see is reflection, you don’t see a single stone. That’s where you want a polarizer that’s hopefully going

⏹️ ▶️ John to knock down that reflection. I think the idea is that like when sunlight reflects off of

⏹️ ▶️ John like a surface like a flat reflective surface of the water that aligns the the the light

⏹️ ▶️ John waves in such a way that the polarizer can knock them out versus sunlight that is just scattering randomly or coming from the Sun

⏹️ ▶️ John the polarizer is not going to cut that out right so the upshot is I took all of my

⏹️ ▶️ John pretty much all of my beach pictures with the long lens with the polarizer on it

⏹️ ▶️ John and it was served multiple purposes it was also protecting my long lens which is also kind of expensive it was preventing

⏹️ ▶️ John water spray from getting up inside and onto my lens right? And it was

⏹️ ▶️ John in theory cutting down glare and stuff. I have to say after the entire vacation of taking pictures

⏹️ ▶️ John it’s hard for me to tell to look at a picture and say oh I can tell how the polarizer helped this

⏹️ ▶️ John picture because if I hadn’t had it I would have seen X Y or Z because it’s hard to see the reflections that aren’t there

⏹️ ▶️ John that would be because there’s plenty of other reflections it’s not like it gets rid of them entirely like for example when I was looking at my shiny

⏹️ ▶️ John car there was still reflections on the car but by twisting

⏹️ ▶️ John the polarizer, you can say, oh, it’s knocking down these reflections, and you’d see those highlights go away, and then they come back,

⏹️ ▶️ John and those highlights go away and come back, but there were other reflections in the car that it didn’t knock down, it was just sort of

⏹️ ▶️ John like the big reflections from the sun bouncing off it or whatever, so. The main reason I went

⏹️ ▶️ John through all this is just to ask both of you, if you have ever used polarizers or lens protectors,

⏹️ ▶️ John or what you think about this entire concept, is it something that,

⏹️ ▶️ John I mean, the protection thing, I don’t think I need opinions on, it’s like, look, If you want to spend 100 bucks to prevent something from damaging

⏹️ ▶️ John your umpteen thousand dollar lens, then do it and whatever cost you have to pay in light that you’re blocking, like whatever.

⏹️ ▶️ John But the polarizer, I’m not, I’m less sure about. So it sounds like Marco, you’ve

⏹️ ▶️ John had some experience with this. Do you actually use these things or do you have them but never actually put them on your cameras?

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I used to use them, but a polarization filter, it’s like polarized sunglasses. As you said, it can

⏹️ ▶️ Marco look really good. It also comes with the cost of reduced light going in, which means, you know,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the other parts of image quality will suffer as a result of less light. Usually I’m not willing to make

⏹️ ▶️ Marco that trade off. The times that I would want it were few and far between,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco whereas the times that I would not want it were almost every other time. And so I would just

⏹️ ▶️ Marco leave it off the lens and I would eventually would just forget about it.

⏹️ ▶️ John I mean, I guess because I didn’t dislike it and most of the time there is more than enough light on a sunny

⏹️ ▶️ John day at the beach that is not, you know, it’s not my problem that I don’t have enough light in that situation. I’ll probably stick to the Polaroid.

⏹️ ▶️ John I mean, it’s still on my lens right now. Same thing with the thing protecting my expensive lens, because now it’s kind of like a

⏹️ ▶️ John security blanket of like, you know, it might scratch it, or because my favorite lens, my favorite, my old favorite APS-C 50

⏹️ ▶️ John millimeter prime, I do have a tiny scratch on that lens. I have no idea how it got there, but it bothers me.

⏹️ ▶️ John And I definitely can’t see this filter made any bad effects

⏹️ ▶️ John on my, the clear one made any bad effects on the pictures took with that camera. So I’m not sure what to do, but write in

⏹️ ▶️ John if you have any opinions on polarizers filters.

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Rock Band audio-sync calibration

⏹️ ▶️ Casey I have a couple of quick pieces of follow-up. First of all, Johannes Zander wrote in with regard to

⏹️ ▶️ Casey the calibration of rock band instruments. So if you’re not familiar, rock band

⏹️ ▶️ Casey was either an offshoot or a clone of Guitar Hero, and both of these games were super

⏹️ ▶️ Casey popular, I want to say in the early aughts maybe. Yeah, 2006, 2007.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco 2006, 2007. Okay, so mid-aughts.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey So these were rhythm games where you played something that vaguely looks

⏹️ ▶️ Casey like a guitar or something that’s kind of like a drum or a bass or what have you.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey And there was a microphone and you would play along with things

⏹️ ▶️ Casey that were falling, like little symbols falling down the screen, kind of sort of like Dance Dance Revolution. And

⏹️ ▶️ Casey they were super fun, or at least I always thought they were super duper fun.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco They were super fun. Okay, good, I’m glad I’m not going here.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco If Sandra Butz about it, Rock Band was awesome. Guitar Hero was awesome. And I miss these games. They were super fun.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Same, yeah. They were super

⏹️ ▶️ Marco great party games. You get this big plastic band going and it takes up

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey your

⏹️ ▶️ Marco entire closet when you’re not playing it.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep, it was a lot of fun. And the problem with this though is it’s a rhythm game and it’s based

⏹️ ▶️ Casey on you reacting. Like your ability to do well is based on you reacting quickly

⏹️ ▶️ Casey to what’s happening on screen and hitting, you know, quote unquote strumming, which really means hitting a button

⏹️ ▶️ Casey or hitting the drum at the right moment. And that means you really need to have

⏹️ ▶️ Casey everything calibrated correctly. You need to have the instrument and the system that it’s attached to

⏹️ ▶️ Casey know when you should be hitting the button to compare that against when you

⏹️ ▶️ Casey did hit the button. And I was reminded via this video that we’ll put in the show notes

⏹️ ▶️ Casey that the way that Rock Band got around this was they had a little camera or at least a light

⏹️ ▶️ Casey sensor. I guess it wasn’t really a full on camera. a light sensor on the guitar

⏹️ ▶️ Casey and also a microphone on the guitar. And there was two different kinds of calibration you could do. One where

⏹️ ▶️ Casey it would play beeps repeatedly and it would measure how long it took for that beep to

⏹️ ▶️ Casey reach the guitar. And presumably, you know, get all the way back to like the PlayStation or Wii or what have you. And then

⏹️ ▶️ Casey a different mode where it would flash the screen white and it would detect how long it took for the guitar

⏹️ ▶️ Casey to see the screen turn white. And so it calibrated itself. And I guess what I’m saying in

⏹️ ▶️ Casey a roundabout way is, John, if you would like to properly calibrate your TV, you just need to bust out Rock

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Band and have it tell you the millisecond delay for your television setup.

⏹️ ▶️ John I mean, that’s the type of thing that I was looking for, some way to do automatic calibration with like an iPhone app

⏹️ ▶️ John or whatever. But like I said last time, in this type of tool

⏹️ ▶️ John chain of measuring delay when the possible

⏹️ ▶️ John effect of the instruments you’re using is a large percentage of the delay

⏹️ ▶️ John that you’re gonna be dialing in. It can really mess things up. So for example, last time we were talking about an iOS app that said, oh, well the

⏹️ ▶️ John iPhone itself induces X amount of delay. So you just have to kind of hard code that by looking up this table of

⏹️ ▶️ John things that I measure with some other equipment, right? And that was a pretty big percentage of the total adjustment.

⏹️ ▶️ John So if you get that wrong, who knows what you could be doing, right? So with the RockBand things, how much delay

⏹️ ▶️ John is introduced by the game or the controller or the sensor? Obviously Rock Band is calibrating

⏹️ ▶️ John itself to itself. So it’s probably fine because it knows what it’s doing within its context. But

⏹️ ▶️ John if I calibrate it with a Rock Band thing, would that be correctly calibrated for watching video on Apple TV?

⏹️ ▶️ John Especially if the TV is in game mode, which may have different latency

⏹️ ▶️ John values for the television itself than the mode you watch movies in or whatever. So really I just wish this was built

⏹️ ▶️ John into the television. And if they have to use a phone app or whatever to do it, that would be great,

⏹️ ▶️ John but the real way to do any of these things is with actual, you know, calibration equipment.

⏹️ ▶️ John And when, when TV reviewers measure sort of the input lag on televisions, they’re using equipment kind of like this, not

⏹️ ▶️ John rock band, but similar like a light sensor and stuff like that. And even in that scenario, there are lots of different choices TV

⏹️ ▶️ John reviewers can make about what they’re measuring and how, you know, how they measure it and what number they’re putting

⏹️ ▶️ John out. They just have to be internally consistent to let you know, Hey, this TV has less lag than this TV, but the absolute values

⏹️ ▶️ John can be affected by how they choose to how and what they choose to measure. So it’s

⏹️ ▶️ John trickier than you might think. I’m just trying to get lip-sync right. I’m not, I don’t need the, I don’t even

⏹️ ▶️ John game on this TV so I don’t need the ultimate lowest possible lag and I was never any good at rock band.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco It would be kind of funny if they actually did use rock band for this purpose and there was like this this

⏹️ ▶️ Marco black market of people like keeping Xbox 360s alive with these old copies of rock band just just

⏹️ ▶️ Marco for this purpose in this specialized industry of calibration.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John That would be

⏹️ ▶️ John amazing. Real calibration equipment actually cost even more than the very expensive plastic

⏹️ ▶️ John instruments that would sell for those games.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey It was expensive, but man was it fun. It’s so fun.

Exit Interview: Series 7

⏹️ ▶️ Casey All right, it is the week before the new iPhone, or at least that’s

⏹️ ▶️ Casey what we are to assume. As we discussed last week, we got press invites

⏹️ ▶️ Casey to watch it. None of us, as of the time of this recording, have been invited to

⏹️ ▶️ Casey watch it in person. We were simply invited to watch the live stream. But it is about that time, and

⏹️ ▶️ Casey we need to do the genuinely excellent idea Marco came up with a few years back,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey which is the iPhone 13 and watch Series 7 exit interviews. Now… Steven Powell Step

⏹️ ▶️ Casey inside, close the door. Jared Polin Yeah, right. I love that you can actually say that because you’ve probably never had

⏹️ ▶️ Casey an exit interview in your life, have you? Steven Powell No. Jared Polin See, there you go. But that was well done. All right. I do not have

⏹️ ▶️ Casey a Series 7 in the house, so I have literally nothing to say about

⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco it. Steven

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Powell I’ve never worked at a place where my boss had an office with the door that closed.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey COREY FEITH-MILLER Fair,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco fair. Yeah,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey I have on and off, but not always. I do not have a Series 7 in the house, so I have nothing to

⏹️ ▶️ Casey say about it. John, does Tina have a Series 7? I don’t recall.

⏹️ ▶️ John JOHN I’m pretty sure she does. I think she just got it because she was going from a 5,

⏹️ ▶️ John and it was like, I think we talked about this before. But I haven’t heard anything bad about

⏹️ ▶️ John it, so I think that’s a good sign. She’s a dedicated Apple Watch user. She wears it every single day. She

⏹️ ▶️ John has many, many watch bands, and she likes it, which is why she keeps getting new ones. And the fact that I haven’t heard anything about

⏹️ ▶️ John this one means it’s probably pretty much doing its job. The only thing I can recall recently is that she still,

⏹️ ▶️ John she still doesn’t seem to have a lot of faith in the cellular functionality.

⏹️ ▶️ John In other words, she always says, she says, I don’t rely on it. Like if it works and it’s there, that’s a great bonus, but she always

⏹️ ▶️ John makes sure she has her phone. I don’t think that’s the fault of the watch, although I do think it is. There may be something to the idea

⏹️ ▶️ John that the, The transmit power of the cell radio inside

⏹️ ▶️ John Apple watches is less than that of a phone just because the battery is so much smaller,

⏹️ ▶️ John but I’m not sure if that’s actually true. All I know is that she does not believe in it.

⏹️ ▶️ John Doesn’t believe it is as reliable as her phone when it comes to cell reception.

⏹️ ▶️ John But she tends, like I said, she tends not to use it like you have. Sometimes Casey would say, I can leave my phone. I don’t need it. I’ve got

⏹️ ▶️ John the watch. I can do everything I need. That’s not how she uses her watch.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Well, and I haven’t done that in years. In fact, when I did my switch from AT&T to

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Verizon, I decided to change my Apple Watch from having cellular

⏹️ ▶️ Casey service. Like obviously the hardware still is capable of it, but what I ended up doing was deciding I’d rather put that money

⏹️ ▶️ Casey toward my iPad and give my iPad cellular service, which I think I

⏹️ ▶️ Casey pretty vastly prefer. Part of that is because I don’t really run anymore. Like I was a semi-avid

⏹️ ▶️ Casey runner and I would leave my phone at home I would run with just my watch and my AirPods,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey which is amazing and I love it, but I just got away from running and it seems silly

⏹️ ▶️ Casey to pay the $15 a month after taxes or whatever it is for something that I used almost never.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey And obviously everyone’s, you know, mileage may vary, but for me, I think

⏹️ ▶️ Casey that money is much better spent on my iPad. And so I do plan, because I’m on a Series 6, I

⏹️ ▶️ Casey do plan on Aaron and I getting new watches this year. And my current intention, as I sit here now,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey is for the first time since I think the cellular watch was a thing, my

⏹️ ▶️ Casey intention is to not get a cellular watch this year and to just get a regular watch, a non-cellular

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Wi-Fi only, and Wi-Fi and Bluetooth only one.

⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah, and I think I’ve seen, I know I’ve seen her look at her messages, like text messages on her watch. So

⏹️ ▶️ John she does, she has been offloading more of her phone functionality. And I say this is relevant to the Series 7

⏹️ ▶️ John because the main feature it had over the 6 the screen was a little bit bigger, which, you know, oh,

⏹️ ▶️ John it’s bigger by a tiny amount, but when the screen space is so small to begin with, every little bit

⏹️ ▶️ John helps. And so I’ve seen her look at messages, and I know sometimes when she’s been out, when I

⏹️ ▶️ John send a message, she gets it on her watch and she replies on her watch, I think. I’m not sure if she’s using that graffiti scribble

⏹️ ▶️ John thing with her finger, if she’s using voice or whatever, but I’ve seen her reply to things on her watch as well, and I

⏹️ ▶️ John feel like that is slightly more likely to happen with the be slightly bigger screen on a Series 7. So

⏹️ ▶️ John I would say the 7 was a boring year where the watch just got a little bit better in

⏹️ ▶️ John a few ways, but that’s fine. And again, with her upgrading from a 5, thumbs up. Yeah, when

⏹️ ▶️ John the 7 came out,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it seemed like a very, very small upgrade because

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the highlights basically were it supported faster charging with its new special USB-C cable that’s different

⏹️ ▶️ Marco from the USB-C cable they’ve sold for years that was like one foot long for travel. So it’s like, if you happen

⏹️ ▶️ Marco to have this one special cable that came with it, it could charge faster, which is useful if you wear it overnight or

⏹️ ▶️ Marco something. So there was that. And the screen got a little bit bigger and a little bit brighter.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco But I came to appreciate it more because I’ve kept my six around for development

⏹️ ▶️ Marco testing and stuff. And I’ve occasionally had to wear the six for a whole day for

⏹️ ▶️ Marco some reason or another. And I really do appreciate the seven’s benefit. Like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it actually was, when you go back, when you’ve been using the 7, you go back to the 6, you realize how much

⏹️ ▶️ Marco of an upgrade it actually was. It actually was pretty good. Like, it wasn’t as big as some of

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the earlier years where they changed more things. You know, it still has the same processor, I think, for the second or third year in

⏹️ ▶️ Marco a row. So it hasn’t gotten faster recently, but it’s pretty much fast enough

⏹️ ▶️ Marco for now. But the bigger and brighter screen, you really do notice.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco And especially, as I was saying, you get a couple more words of text. and I wear the small size,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the 41 millimeter now, having the smaller screen in the first place, that little bit more

⏹️ ▶️ Marco really does help. You really do get a little bit more space. This was the first size watch that I wore

⏹️ ▶️ Marco that was able to have the on-screen keyboard, and I’ve only had to use it like two or three

⏹️ ▶️ Marco times in the year I’ve been wearing this, but I was glad it was there those two or three times. Like one of

⏹️ ▶️ Marco them I had to type in my Apple ID password, and I can’t imagine having to do that like any other, like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco with the scribble or whatever else, that would be terrible. It was bad enough on the keyboard.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco So anyway, I’ve actually really enjoyed the Series 7 and this is the first year that I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco tried the titanium as the metal. I gotta say I’m totally converted.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I love the titanium. It’s really nice. So I’ve been

⏹️ ▶️ Marco a silver steel person for years and years and years and I still love the

⏹️ ▶️ Marco look of the silver steel but this year I was tired of buying the same watch

⏹️ ▶️ Marco every time, basically. And so I’m like, just for variety, let me try titanium. Everyone says it’s really nice.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Let me see it. And I love how much lighter it is. Like,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I love a light watch. Like, in the regular watch world, I mean, most regular watches are

⏹️ ▶️ Marco lighter than the Apple Watch, but because they don’t have batteries, giant lithium batteries taking up most of their volume.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco But still, in the regular watch world, they also have titanium watches there, and the Apple Watch

⏹️ ▶️ Marco is not as light as them because again, the battery. But I love a light watch. It’s so

⏹️ ▶️ Marco delightful feeling to have this light thing on your wrist that you can barely even tell it’s there.

⏹️ ▶️ John Did you get the space black titanium or the regular titanium?

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco No, I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco got the silver titanium, which I think looks better personally. The space black titanium I think

⏹️ ▶️ Marco is so close to the black or near black aluminum

⏹️ ▶️ Marco colors that I don’t think that’s really worth it in my opinion. But that’s up to

⏹️ ▶️ Marco other people. I don’t care what you buy. Anyway, but yeah, it has a very different finish. Like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco where the aluminum is kind of bead blast or whatever. So it’s this like kind of diffuse, like staticky

⏹️ ▶️ Marco finish. The titanium is brushed in one direction,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco like long ways on the sides. And it just, it looks really nice. It has a wonderful

⏹️ ▶️ Marco way it plays with the light. And it is like a little bit more subtle. And frankly, it

⏹️ ▶️ Marco looks a little bit more high end than the polished stainless steel. And that surprised

⏹️ ▶️ Marco me, because I love the stainless steel look, but I love the titanium even more. And that’s why I was actually, I’m actually kind of disappointed

⏹️ ▶️ Marco that the rumors, which we’ll get to in a little bit, are kind of unclear as to whether there

⏹️ ▶️ Marco will be a titanium small watch. Well, I hope there is, because

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’ve really come to enjoy it. But anyway, I’ve been very happy with this watch,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and I keep using it more and more. Like, you know, as time is going on,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m wearing mechanicals less, and we’re in the Apple Watch more as the Apple Watch gets better.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco And so I expect that trend to continue this coming year, but the Series 7, honestly, I’m at

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the point where, I say this during a lot of the interviews, we’re like, I actually

⏹️ ▶️ Marco don’t know what I would change about this. And I’m sure Apple will show us next week why I absolutely

⏹️ ▶️ Marco must have to have

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John the new thing.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco But right now, as it stands now, I’m not sure what I would change besides software things.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I would love to have tons of software tweaks I could suggest but hardware wise

⏹️ ▶️ Marco It’s pretty nice already.

⏹️ ▶️ John Apple could easily make you buy this by just making it a lot thinner I don’t think they will because they need the battery But like

⏹️ ▶️ John that’s the you know Because the Apple watch unlike many of Apple’s other products has not been on

⏹️ ▶️ John a trajectory of getting thinner In fact, I think the series 0 is still the thinnest one that they ever sold maybe

⏹️ ▶️ John so if and when we get to a point where there’s some kind of technological

⏹️ ▶️ John advancement that allows a significant decrease in thickness. That is the obvious next step because

⏹️ ▶️ John the Apple Watch is as thick as it is not based on style because plenty of watches are big and chunky as a style choice.

⏹️ ▶️ John It’s as thin as it is because that’s as thin as they can possibly make it while still having

⏹️ ▶️ John good battery life and I don’t think they want to sacrifice battery life to keep trying to make it

⏹️ ▶️ John thinner. In fact they’ve made it thicker over time so I don’t think they’re gonna make the

⏹️ ▶️ John Series 8 really thinner but that would do it. If they had one that was like half the thickness and styled to

⏹️ ▶️ John be thin like that, you would buy it immediately.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Well, maybe. So it got, the thickest one, I believe, is still the Series 3. It went up in

⏹️ ▶️ Marco thickness, up to 3, and then with 4, they kind of cut it back down. And I think we’re still

⏹️ ▶️ Marco below what the 3 was. But regardless, the way it’s styled and the way it sits off

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the wrist with a little sensor bump, I think it actually is basically thin enough. You know, right

⏹️ ▶️ Marco now it looks, I mean, I don’t have the numbers in front of me, but the body without the little puck on the bottom looks to be somewhere

⏹️ ▶️ Marco in the like 11 or 12 millimeter thickness range. And for watches of this size, that’s

⏹️ ▶️ Marco very, very common. Like that’s, this is not, it isn’t an ultra thin watch, but this is not a thick watch.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Like when you compare it to other mechanicals of similar size classes, it’s not a thick watch anymore. The Series 3

⏹️ ▶️ Marco was too thick, but the modern ones are not in my opinion. And so I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco don’t think they really need to go thinner. So, I mean, overall, like again,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco like I think the Series 7, I think it’s a very good watch. And

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m, you know, the only thing that I wish for, again, are software things or, you know,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco more sensors as Apple is rumored to add. And that’s, you know, that might get me because that’s one of the reasons

⏹️ ▶️ Marco why I wear it so much is health sensors. I really appreciate that, you know,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco as I’m pretty solidly middle-aged now. And, you know, like I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco love, like when I had COVID a few weeks back, I love that I had a history of my oxygen levels.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco And so I could make sure that it was, that, you know, things were staying within healthy ranges and

⏹️ ▶️ Marco not changing. It even, thanks Apple, it even alerted me

⏹️ ▶️ Marco after I was, you know, like, you know, locked in my house for a few days, it alerted me

⏹️ ▶️ Marco that my, my like step count and calorie burns were down compared to usual.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco And I, first of all, I was, you know, I was kind of like, you know, screw you, I have COVID, I can’t leave my house.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco But also I was like, you know, I’m actually glad that it noticed. Like it gave me, the health

⏹️ ▶️ Marco app on my phone gave me a notification saying like, hey, we detected a change in your pattern.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco And then it’s a wonderful euphemism. And you go in and you see what the change is. And it’s like this huge drop off in

⏹️ ▶️ Marco my activity. And I’m like, oh God, thanks. I don’t feel good about this, but

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I at least know why. And I’m glad that was there for me. The day before I tested positive,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I didn’t feel super great. And I got the high heart rate alert for the very first time that’s like,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco hey, your heart rate’s a bit high considering you don’t seem to be moving. And at the time I just kind of wrote it off

⏹️ ▶️ Marco as, well, maybe my watch is having a false alarm, but I had never seen that happen.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’ve never gotten that as a false alarm. So I thought like something was probably not wrong

⏹️ ▶️ Marco with me and it was just weird, but I was feeling really tired that day. And sure enough, the next

⏹️ ▶️ Marco morning I test positive and I actually had COVID that was festering during that time. So something

⏹️ ▶️ Marco was off. So it actually did work. And so, you know, I really appreciate the Apple

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Watch health sensors. And so if the rumors are true that they’re gonna add maybe a body temperature, you know, sensor

⏹️ ▶️ Marco to detect fluctuations in your body temperature or, you know, abnormalities, like, that’s really good to know. That’s

⏹️ ▶️ Marco useful information. Ideally, I would love, you know, in the future, I know they’ve been working

⏹️ ▶️ Marco for a long time, as many companies have, for a through-the-skin blood glucose monitoring

⏹️ ▶️ Marco method. That’s obviously massive for diabetics, But even for non-diabetics,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco to be able to track your blood glucose throughout the day would be incredible and would open up all sorts of new avenues for

⏹️ ▶️ Marco health monitoring and management. So if they ever get that, that would be a game changer.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco But even if they stay with simpler stuff like body temperature and blood oxygen, I still get value out of that.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco And so whatever they can do to add more sensors and more health monitoring and more proactive

⏹️ ▶️ Marco alerts of things being off, I am all for that, especially as I inevitably get

⏹️ ▶️ Marco older.

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Exit Interview: iPhone 13 Pro

⏹️ ▶️ Casey All right, so let’s talk iPhone 13 Pro. Now John, remind me, you are on the 12

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Pro or the, you’re on the 12 Pro this year, right?

⏹️ ▶️ John 12 Pro and my wife has a 13 Pro. Okay.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Do you want to channel your inner Tina and tell me what you slash she thinks about the

⏹️ ▶️ John 13?

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah.

⏹️ ▶️ John So, I mean, again, she hasn’t really had any complaints about her phone for the most part. Her main complaint

⏹️ ▶️ John was the MagSafe battery pack is not as good for her

⏹️ ▶️ John uses as the old thing where you’d get a battery case from Apple that would only work with

⏹️ ▶️ John your phone. We talked about this back when this product came out. You know, the good thing about the battery pack is in theory you can reuse

⏹️ ▶️ John it on your next phone, which has generally not been true of Apple’s battery cases. But the bad thing is that it is

⏹️ ▶️ John easy to knock off your phone, it’s smaller, has lower capacity, and it’s just generally more annoying than

⏹️ ▶️ John just a very snug-fitting battery case. how does she destroy her battery with Pokemon Go, which she

⏹️ ▶️ John plays a lot. Uh, and that game totally mauls the battery on the phone.

⏹️ ▶️ John I like, I feel like there’s special features that have been added to that game to destroy your battery. Is it doing Bitcoin mining? I don’t

⏹️ ▶️ John know, but boy, does that game destroy your battery. So.

⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey Can I, can I

⏹️ ▶️ Casey interrupt, please? I have been playing just a teeny bit of Pokemon Go in the support of Declan, who has also

⏹️ ▶️ Casey been playing a teeny bit of Pokemon Go. It don’t, don’t worry about it. Long story, but suffice to say

⏹️ ▶️ Casey that game, the, the rumors of how bad it destroys your battery are complete

⏹️ ▶️ Casey BS. It is so much worse than people say. Now granted, I did

⏹️ ▶️ Casey put the beta on not too long after I started playing Pokemon Go, so maybe I’m misattributing

⏹️ ▶️ Casey my battery loss, but oh my gosh, it is a battery

⏹️ ▶️ Casey murderer. It deserves a capital punishment for battery murder. It’s ridiculous

⏹️ ▶️ Casey how bad that game utterly destroys your battery. And It is no wonder that

⏹️ ▶️ Casey people probably like Tina have like two in three battery packs or carrying around like a laptop

⏹️ ▶️ Casey size battery pack with a cable attached to it. Oh my word, is it bad? What

⏹️ ▶️ Casey is it doing back there?

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Well, think about it. It has, it’s using GPS and the camera and you’re watching the screen the whole

⏹️ ▶️ Marco time and

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John it’s doing AR

⏹️ ▶️ Marco projection and yeah, and a 3D like it’s basically spending as much computing power using

⏹️ ▶️ Marco as many of the devices, high power, you know, methods as possible.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey It’s

⏹️ ▶️ Casey bananas. Like, I cannot believe it. Yeah,

⏹️ ▶️ John this is why my wife’s purse weighs so much, because it’s filled with, well, it’s filled with like four

⏹️ ▶️ John phones, because she pays in multiple accounts, because it’s like the people play multiple slot machines at once in Vegas,

⏹️ ▶️ John right?

⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey No, yeah, yeah, yeah.

⏹️ ▶️ John And also, all of the PowerPak battery pack, lithium ion batteries that she’s got in there,

⏹️ ▶️ John on top of, like, she used to have her main phone inside a battery case, now she has the little MagSafe, and she has

⏹️ ▶️ John the MagSafe thing in her car, so when it’s on the MagSafe car mount in her car, it’s also charging, but she also

⏹️ ▶️ John has wire connectors in her car, just as a constant battle. But anyway, so that was her only real complaint

⏹️ ▶️ John about the 13 was the little, the smaller battery thing that comes off real easy is not as good

⏹️ ▶️ John as a battery case. But otherwise, she’s been mostly fine with it. I don’t use her

⏹️ ▶️ John phone, but I occasionally do pick it up to do something with it or take a picture because if it’s, I

⏹️ ▶️ John tend to, if both of our phones are around, I usually want to take a picture with her thing because her camera is better than mine because I’ve got

⏹️ ▶️ John the 12 Pro, So I use her phone to take pictures or whatever. And obviously I haven’t been using

⏹️ ▶️ John it for the year that she’s had it, but I have picked it up a lot of times and I’ve never gotten used to

⏹️ ▶️ John the giant camera bump and the case that highlights the giant camera bump. I’ve never gotten used to the way her phone

⏹️ ▶️ John sits on the table because it is elevated from the, she’s got an Apple leather case, I believe on it.

⏹️ ▶️ John It doesn’t sit on the table evenly. And when I pick it up and use it, my finger hits the little, you know,

⏹️ ▶️ John the wall that’s around the camera bump. And so that’s my main complaint about 13 Pro. I feel like the camera

⏹️ ▶️ John has crossed a line where it is bothersome to me, which does not bode well for the 14 Pro, which I’m supposedly

⏹️ ▶️ John getting this year, which as we’ll talk about in a little bit, is supposed to have an even bigger camera bump,

⏹️ ▶️ John but I guess that’s just the price of whatever cool camera it’s gonna have. So as far as I’m concerned, 13 Pro

⏹️ ▶️ John has been perfectly satisfactory other than the battery case issue, which is not a thing for me,

⏹️ ▶️ John but it’s a thing for my wife and the camera being a little bit too big.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey What about ProMotion, the fast refresh rate? Do you notice it?

⏹️ ▶️ John Oh, I have a problem with ProMotion, right? So we talked about it when the 13 Pro came out. I’m like, I don’t care about using

⏹️ ▶️ John my iPhone, I don’t care. And I think I have ProMotion on my, I have the latest

⏹️ ▶️ John iPad Pro, I believe. I have the M1 iPad Pro, that’s the latest one, right? Yes, I believe that’s right.

⏹️ ▶️ John And that has ProMotion, right? The M1 iPad Pro?

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yes, every iPad Pro, except for the 9.7 and like the very first generation 9.7 and 12.9

⏹️ ▶️ Marco didn’t have it. but starting from the 10.5, all the other ones did. Yeah, well, so anyway, I’ve had that M1,

⏹️ ▶️ John I’ve had Pro since it was introduced and I use it pretty much every single day and I was like, ah, you know, ProMotion

⏹️ ▶️ John is not a big deal for me. But in the past month or so, every time I pick up my

⏹️ ▶️ John wife’s iPhone 13 Pro, I see the ProMotion. I don’t know why I wasn’t

⏹️ ▶️ John seeing it or noticing it before. I mean, I can notice it, I mean, I look for it, but I’ve been like unbidden, it has been leapt to my mind.

⏹️ ▶️ John I was like, whoa, that’s so much smoother than my phone. And it’s bothersome. I mean, so I guess

⏹️ ▶️ John I’m getting to the point where phones without ProMotion seem a little bit,

⏹️ ▶️ John you know, stuttery to me and I don’t want that. Like I

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco liked it better when

⏹️ ▶️ John I didn’t care about the difference, but now I feel like with the phone, I kind of do

⏹️ ▶️ John and every time I use their phone, I’m like, oh, this makes my phone feel bad. So I’m,

⏹️ ▶️ John one of the things I’m looking forward to on the 14 Pro is I will finally have a phone with ProMotion, I endorse

⏹️ ▶️ John it.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, it’s a big deal. Like I have loved promotion and it’s

⏹️ ▶️ Marco one of those things that I didn’t think I was noticing after the first few days

⏹️ ▶️ Marco until I mentioned earlier this summer, I did an experiment where I tried to use the mini for a few days and I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco really noticed its absence. In a way that I don’t notice it on the Mac. Like when I use a MacBook

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Pro with its built-in screen, you know, the modern MacBook Pros have promotion. When I use that, I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco don’t really notice it there. And then when I go back to my, you know, big Pro Display XDR that doesn’t support

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it, I don’t notice the absence of it. But on iPads and iPhones, I do instantly

⏹️ ▶️ Marco notice its presence and later its absence. And so it’s been wonderful.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’ve loved promotion. I also, I love the cameras on this thing too. Like, you know, now that I guess I’m stealing

⏹️ ▶️ Marco a turn here. So I’ve loved the cameras on the 13 Pro. The

⏹️ ▶️ Marco 3X, I’m not super crazy about the 3X lens.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco The 1X and the wide, but especially the 1X, have just been fantastic. I have

⏹️ ▶️ Marco enjoyed occasionally using the macro on the wide, like, you know, just for a little pragmatic reasons

⏹️ ▶️ Marco here and there, like, you know, scanning, like taking a picture of a tag on the back of a router or something like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco that. That’s been wonderful. Little, you know, day-to-day life things. You know, again, like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco when I went to the Mini that didn’t support that, I missed the macro mode. I realized,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco oh, I actually use that. The 3x lens

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I wish was both a better camera and was

⏹️ ▶️ Marco not as zoomed in because where we have it now is

⏹️ ▶️ Marco you have nothing between 1x and 3x hardware wise. And oftentimes

⏹️ ▶️ Marco what I want is between those. And so what has to happen then is it just crops the image off the

⏹️ ▶️ Marco 1x and that’s fine. the One X is great, but you know, it’s, that’s not, that’s not an amazing solution.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco And the three X camera, just like the 2.5 and 2X cameras that came before

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it in previous models, the three X camera is not very good. Like optically, it’s just not

⏹️ ▶️ Marco nearly as good as the One X camera. And you do notice. And so I find myself

⏹️ ▶️ Marco not using it that much as a combination of it, you know, not really being the

⏹️ ▶️ Marco distance I often need and it being optically worse. So I look forward to any improvements they can

⏹️ ▶️ Marco make in those areas whether they can cover a wider range and hardware in some way

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and or whether they can improve the optics of the telephoto camera. But otherwise 13

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Pro feature wise you know between the the ProMotion and the macro

⏹️ ▶️ Marco camera and and the overall camera system it’s been really really great. One

⏹️ ▶️ Marco thing I still wish for is this is very heavy

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I wish it was lighter it’s a very dense phone in the pocket it’s big

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and it’s heavy and this is apparently going to be the smallest phone they’re gonna make and starting

⏹️ ▶️ Marco next week that I I hope and I know the rumors are not backing

⏹️ ▶️ Marco me up here at all with anything useful here but but I hope that future iPhones that are

⏹️ ▶️ Marco that are of this slot in the lineup up, meaning the smallest phone with all the pro

⏹️ ▶️ Marco features. I hope they find a way to make them lighter. Whether it’s

⏹️ ▶️ Marco changing out the stainless steel band or whatever, or other changes, who knows what they could do with

⏹️ ▶️ Marco materials or whatever, but it’s a very heavy phone. So that being said, one of the biggest

⏹️ ▶️ Marco contributions to weight is the battery. And the battery life’s been great! I’ve been very pleased

⏹️ ▶️ Marco with the battery life. You know, even during this beta season where beta battery life has been pretty rough,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I a lot to start with and that has helped a lot. So I’m very happy with the performance,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the battery, you know, the screen, the cameras, all that stuff is great. I just

⏹️ ▶️ Marco wish it was lighter and maybe I might go a little smaller on the body

⏹️ ▶️ Marco too, but hey, you know, it’s a big screen, it’s beautiful, whatever. So just lighter is my number one request for future phones.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco But overall, this has been a great phone. I don’t leave it in haste.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco is a wonderful phone and if I had to keep using it forever and nothing else ever came out that was better than

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it, I’d be fine. But fortunately, that’s not how things work. So we’re going to have amazing things next week.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, for me, the 120 hertz, I noticed it a lot early on. And

⏹️ ▶️ Casey now I do feel like I notice it, but it doesn’t. I think I

⏹️ ▶️ Casey misattribute what’s happening. So when I use an older phone,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey I feel like I’m misattributing it to the slowness of the phone rather

⏹️ ▶️ Casey than the slowness of the screen. I just assume, oh, well, this phone is older, so it’s a little choppier and slower. But it’s not

⏹️ ▶️ Casey that. It’s that it’s actually the screen is half as fast. But I forget

⏹️ ▶️ Casey that that’s a thing. And so I think I often misattribute it in that sense, especially since iOS is

⏹️ ▶️ Casey usually very, very good about keeping pretty good performance, even several models, into the past.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey For me, all in all, I love the 13 Pro. I think it’s a phenomenal

⏹️ ▶️ Casey phone. This is the first phone in two years, I guess it was three phones ago

⏹️ ▶️ Casey that I have not yet shattered, so that’s good. Related, it’s the first phone I put a case on in three

⏹️ ▶️ Casey years. So I’ll let you decide if those are related events. I think they might be.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey But with regard to cases, I was a huge fan of the Apple leather case, the

⏹️ ▶️ Casey black Apple leather case. And at least at launch time, I don’t know if that’s still the case. Uh,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey there was no black Apple leather case and that is a super bummer.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey I, speaking like we were earlier, what Marco was saying about, oh, I’ll just throw an AppleCare. Oh, I’ll just throw

⏹️ ▶️ Casey in this like $80 Apple case. Uh, I would just, you know, add that in, not even think twice

⏹️ ▶️ Casey about it. And now there are at least again, at the time of launch a year ago,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey there was no app, black Apple leather case. And I’m still a little grumpy about it, especially because this Nudient case, which the name

⏹️ ▶️ Casey is kind of bad to begin with. It is not in good shape now. Like it is, it has not

⏹️ ▶️ Casey stood the test of time terribly well. So I don’t know if there isn’t a black Apple leather case

⏹️ ▶️ Casey next year or in a month, in a week even, I’m not sure what I’m gonna do, but.

⏹️ ▶️ John But in another plug for my, like, what was it? Like a $30 cheapo, but

⏹️ ▶️ John Olexar iPhone 12 Pro black leather case with an open bottom that I bought when the 12

⏹️ ▶️ John Pro was new. I mean, it looks like it’s been used, but it’s held up amazingly

⏹️ ▶️ John well, amazingly well. For like, it was like less than half the price of the Apple leather thing. Open bottom,

⏹️ ▶️ John which is what I wanted, black leather case. Good job, OXR.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, I’m gonna have to look into that for this next one if Apple doesn’t have a first party thing and maybe I’ll just look into that regardless.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey The thing that is really a bugbear and I’m grumpy about this because I spent a lot of time outside

⏹️ ▶️ Casey this year. Does San Francisco not have any

⏹️ ▶️ Casey weather? I thought it had at least some amount of weather And I thought it at least occasionally, I thought

⏹️ ▶️ Casey every once in a while Carl the Fog went away and there was this magical thing called sunlight in San Francisco.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey That does exist in San Francisco, does it not? I’m pretty sure it does. Because oh my

⏹️ ▶️ Casey gosh, can we please have a phone that can be in

⏹️ ▶️ Casey sunlight for more than 45 seconds before the screen dims? Like it is, I’m being a little hyperbolic here.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey But oh my gosh, I spent a lot of time at the little community pool that we joined this year. And

⏹️ ▶️ Casey my word, if you have this thing in the sun, particularly if you’re on cellular, for

⏹️ ▶️ Casey more than a few seconds, it thermal regulates that screen right down to nothingness. And it is

⏹️ ▶️ Casey so frustrating and so hard to see. My number one wish, I’m not even kidding,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey my number one wish for the iPhone 14 is to do better in full sunlight.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey I know I probably sound utterly bananas. I totally accept that, but this is a

⏹️ ▶️ Casey legitimate thing that I swear to you is worse than this phone than any of the phones that have come before it.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey And it’s bad on my iPad too. Maybe that’s because of age, maybe it’s because of software, I don’t know.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey But do not like. Anyway, that being said, I do like the fast screen.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Again, I don’t wanna belabor the ultra wide band park bench slash picnic table, but that

⏹️ ▶️ Casey is pretty freaking cool. And I don’t know if that was new with the 13 or new with the 12. I tried to look this up earlier and couldn’t figure it out.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey But having a phone that’s three times faster, that’s internet connection can occasionally maybe three times faster

⏹️ ▶️ Casey than my home gigabit internet connection. That’s pretty cool. I was trying to look up what else was new with this

⏹️ ▶️ Casey phone. Tell me gentlemen, how many times have you used cinematic mode? None. Exactly.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco But I mean, that’s

⏹️ ▶️ Marco not, like I never, I don’t even use portrait mode. Like I, like that’s a bad example for me because, you know,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco whatever they’re like, you know, trick photo mode of the year is, I probably don’t

⏹️ ▶️ Marco use it.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, I actually do use portrait mode from time to time. And I think it’s gotten to the point that it’s acceptable now. I wouldn’t

⏹️ ▶️ Casey say it’s good, but I’d say it’s at least acceptable. But I think I used cinematic mode like

⏹️ ▶️ Casey once or twice when it first was a thing, and I haven’t touched it since. In fact, I don’t even know if it’s on, I don’t know how to

⏹️ ▶️ Casey turn it on, I know nothing about it, I’ve already forgotten everything.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’ve decided that I’m not actually a filmmaker.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey Yeah, exactly.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m very happy admitting to myself that that’s just not me. Yep, yep. Yeah, I

⏹️ ▶️ John don’t wonder who that feature is for because people who are actual filmmakers don’t want it in the same way

⏹️ ▶️ John that people who are interested in photography don’t want portrait mode. And then people who

⏹️ ▶️ John are casual, it’s too complicated to think about like what they showed people doing in the demo videos of like I’m doing.

⏹️ ▶️ John It’s hard enough to hold your phone and try to keep your family in the frame as they’re moving around. Can you imagine also like,

⏹️ ▶️ John I know you can do this after the fact, but like selecting who’s gonna be in focus or whatever, that’s

⏹️ ▶️ John people don’t wanna, they just wanna hold up their phone and record and then be done with it. They don’t wanna have to spend any amount of time

⏹️ ▶️ John deciding who the phone focuses on and who gets the fake blur.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep. But all in all, as much as I whined a couple of times in the last few minutes,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey all in all, I really love this phone. I love the flat sides.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey I wish I had the, or I wish I wasn’t so much of a klutz and that I could use it without a

⏹️ ▶️ Casey case because it does feel nice without a case, a little slipperier, more slippy than I wish, but still, it does feel

⏹️ ▶️ Casey nice. I popped the case off a minute ago just to look. I love this midnight blue or whatever this is called,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Pacific blue. So, you know, it would be neat to have a pro phone with kind of vibrant colors. Like

⏹️ ▶️ Casey I would be so here for that. Well, that’s not even true. I’d probably end up buying black because I’m an idiot and I’m a loser, but

⏹️ ▶️ Casey I would be here for the idea

⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco of it. No,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco you’re just a nerd, Casey. Nerds default to black. It’s fine. You know, I’ve been there myself

⏹️ ▶️ Marco many times. Like I know how it works, but no, I’m with you. The colors, God, just please more

⏹️ ▶️ Marco personality in the colors. Please.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey That’s a very good way to put it. Please more personality in the colors. That would be excellent. But all in

⏹️ ▶️ Casey all, a really good phone. I really think that if they did basically

⏹️ ▶️ Casey a little bit better camera and, God help me, a little bit better thermal regulation such that the screen

⏹️ ▶️ Casey wasn’t dimming constantly in sunlight, if they did those two things, it would be an insta-buy for me. And

⏹️ ▶️ Casey I’m sure whatever they say next week, I’m not going to kid myself, I’m going

⏹️ ▶️ Casey to get it. It’s just what I do now. But I am really hopeful that

⏹️ ▶️ Casey they improve the camera a little bit. Not to say it’s lacking, but I hope they improve the camera. I hope they do a little

⏹️ ▶️ Casey bit better with these thermals. I don’t feel like the phone is slow at this point. There’s

⏹️ ▶️ Casey almost nothing I can think of that I feel like I’m running out of horsepower

⏹️ ▶️ Casey or RAM for that matter. So really, just more of the same, just give me more of it. I’ll take

⏹️ ▶️ Casey that please and thank you.

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iPhone 14 rumors

⏹️ ▶️ John That’s potentially some good news for you. Now we can move on to the rumors for the announcement and

⏹️ ▶️ John spoil everything for next week’s show. Yes please. So iPhone 14, 14 Pro and 14 Pro Max.

⏹️ ▶️ John We talked about this before. The big change in the rumors this year is that

⏹️ ▶️ John you will be able to get a big phone that’s not a Pro. So the 14 will come in big and small sizes and

⏹️ ▶️ John the 14 Pro will come in big and small sizes. There’s no more mini. I’m

⏹️ ▶️ John starting with the information that we pretty much know for sure. I think that is, everyone agrees on that.

⏹️ ▶️ John The pros having the A16 and the non-pros not having the A16 is

⏹️ ▶️ John another thing that has been heavily rumored and seems pretty sure this year. That’s going to be a bummer because the

⏹️ ▶️ John years when both the pro and non-pro had the same system on a chip were great, but it doesn’t look

⏹️ ▶️ John like that’s happening for a variety of reasons. maybe it’s yields on the new, you know,

⏹️ ▶️ John five nanometer, extra good five nanometer process, I always forget what it’s called, 5NP

⏹️ ▶️ John or something, whatever the hell TSMC calls it. It’s called 5Pro Max. Yeah,

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco although,

⏹️ ▶️ John does the A15 use that process as well? I don’t even remember. Anyway, A16 only on the pros, probably

⏹️ ▶️ John won’t make a difference to you. The other thing you mentioned, RAM, I think both the pro and non-pro are

⏹️ ▶️ John getting six gigs of RAM and I think the non-pro only had four last year, is that true? Something like that. These are not

⏹️ ▶️ John things that most people notice, right? So what does the Pro have to differentiate it? Well, the first thing is that

⏹️ ▶️ John it doesn’t have a notch. It has a different thing in its screen for where the face

⏹️ ▶️ John ID and front-facing camera stuff goes. If you see the pictures of the screen pieces, it looks

⏹️ ▶️ John kind of like a sideways lowercase I. It’s like a lozenge and then a circular dot for the camera.

⏹️ ▶️ John But the latest round of sort of late-breaking rumors that we’ll put some links to is that sideways

⏹️ ▶️ John I will have the gap between the stem on the I and the dot

⏹️ ▶️ John on the eye, that those screen pixels, although they exist, will be turned off. So instead

⏹️ ▶️ John of looking like a sideways lowercase letter I, it will instead look like a sideways lozenge

⏹️ ▶️ John that is disconnected from the top of the screen. Now, in total area,

⏹️ ▶️ John whether it’s a lozenge or a sideways lowercase letter I, that is less total

⏹️ ▶️ John screen area that is removed. You will have more pixels on the screen than you did even with the new smaller

⏹️ ▶️ John notch. But in terms of how much those things intrude

⏹️ ▶️ John on the space available for lines of text or lists or like whatever,

⏹️ ▶️ John I’m not sure it’s much of an improvement and it may actually be worse. Because if you look at the pictures,

⏹️ ▶️ John it’s almost as if they took the notch, made it narrower, but then disconnected it from the top of the

⏹️ ▶️ John phone. So now screen pixels can flow above it, but that doesn’t help you when you’re scrolling a list because you kind

⏹️ ▶️ John of got to stop the list scrolling before you hit the lozenge or the notch or whatever.

⏹️ ▶️ John And maybe you will scroll past it and you’ll see like a half a line of text above it or something, but I don’t know. I’m not

⏹️ ▶️ John convinced about this. Now I understand what they’re doing. Like as we’ve said, ever since the notch was introduced, it’s not like

⏹️ ▶️ John Apple loves the notch. The notch is a necessary evil and to the extent that Apple can get rid of it, they will. And

⏹️ ▶️ John so over time, Apple has continued to shrink the notch in terms of the total area of the screen that is notched

⏹️ ▶️ John out. That continues with the Pro models. They have fewer pixels

⏹️ ▶️ John that don’t exist because of the face ID and the front-facing camera. And so they continue to march towards

⏹️ ▶️ John not having, having all the pixels. We’re not there yet, we won’t be there next year, but eventually I feel like that’s where Apple

⏹️ ▶️ John wants to go. So this is a step in that direction. I’m not entirely sure this step brings

⏹️ ▶️ John anything to the customer, other than having an easy visual differentiator to let people know that you have

⏹️ ▶️ John the Pro phone, which is itself a feature that Apple probably cares about and some users care about as well.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Well, I will say the late-breaking rumor that they might put the dots in

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the little eye gap to show, like, that is actually really nice and that’s

⏹️ ▶️ Marco a neat little feature that’s very useful. So I’m looking forward to that if that’s true. I think that’s very, very nice.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco But yeah, ultimately, I think it will just look more modern. I mean, the

⏹️ ▶️ Marco current notch style has been there since the iPhone X. it’s been there a number

⏹️ ▶️ Marco of years, Android phones have moved on to the hole punch style, fairly

⏹️ ▶️ Marco recently. And so if Apple continued to have the same notch style,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think it would start to look dated. So I think this is about the time to change it.

⏹️ ▶️ John I mean, it was a differentiator because Apple’s particular shape and style of

⏹️ ▶️ John the notch was, even when they use little icons to show this is an iPhone, you can see

⏹️ ▶️ John a little, we talked about this when we talked about the notch, I go, Apple’s using it for branding, right? not

⏹️ ▶️ John because they love it, but because, hey, if it’s there, it should be part of our brand. When I see it

⏹️ ▶️ John with the lozenge or the sideways eye or however they decide to do it,

⏹️ ▶️ John and not that it looks like an Android phone, but it doesn’t immediately say iPhone to me. And I feel like it is less

⏹️ ▶️ John distinct. It is because there’s lots of different hole punch cameras that have been on Android phones for years. They’re all over the place,

⏹️ ▶️ John different shapes, different sizes. This one will be different. I don’t think I’ve seen an Android screen

⏹️ ▶️ John with either of these exact arrangements, whether it be the eye or the lozenge or whatever. But I think it’s

⏹️ ▶️ John gonna take a while for me to look at that and have it read as iPhone. You know, I’m sure we’ll get there. And eventually, I

⏹️ ▶️ John don’t know what Apple’s gonna do when they can eventually get to the point where they can just make the whole front of the phone a screen,

⏹️ ▶️ John because then how the heck do you make an icon of that? It’s literally just a vertical rounded rectangle, featureless vertical

⏹️ ▶️ John rounded rectangle with nothing to differentiate it. And it’s kind of almost like, and especially

⏹️ ▶️ John since Apple continues to change, to subtly change the proportions of its phones over the years, you know, starting

⏹️ ▶️ John from the sort of short squat 3.5 inch and the tall skinny, the iPhone 5 screen. And then like,

⏹️ ▶️ John it has changed proportions. So it’s not even like they can show you a rectangle and go, oh, I can tell by the proportions that’s supposed to be

⏹️ ▶️ John an iPhone because it is so kind of like, era dependent. Anyway, that’s

⏹️ ▶️ John a future Apple problem, I suppose. Speaking of the screen, the other rumor is always on

⏹️ ▶️ John screen due to improved screen technology where there will be a lock screen that will just be always on kind of like

⏹️ ▶️ John the watch is. As part of that potential feature is the minimum

⏹️ ▶️ John one Hertz refresh. I believe the current ones, even though they do have variable refresh, I don’t think they go down to one Hertz

⏹️ ▶️ John like the watch does. I think their minimum is like what? 20 or five or something? I think it’s something like 20. Yeah,

⏹️ ▶️ John anyway, the always on screen thing, that’s been

⏹️ ▶️ John rumored for a little bit. I think it was even rumored for the last phone. That’s the type of thing that Apple

⏹️ ▶️ John can do a go, no go on pretty late in the game because

⏹️ ▶️ John the one hertz minimum refresh, that benefits battery life no matter what Apple does. You don’t have to have an always on

⏹️ ▶️ John screen to reap the benefits of having the one hertz minimum refresh

⏹️ ▶️ John on the LTPO screen technology, the lower power and everything, right? But it seems like this may be

⏹️ ▶️ John the year for the always on lock screen. And kind of like on the watch, I imagine it will be an option that you can turn

⏹️ ▶️ John off for maximum battery life. Don’t use the always on lock screen because even though you’re probably only lighting up a small number

⏹️ ▶️ John of pixels, it’s better not to light any of them up. So I’m kind of looking forward to that because I think there’s a lot of fun things you could do with the

⏹️ ▶️ John phone there, but I’m not entirely convinced that it’s not the type of feature that

⏹️ ▶️ John Apple might punt.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco We’ll see. I’m guessing we actually get that one because the

⏹️ ▶️ Marco lock screen widgets being added this year and some minor hints that were

⏹️ ▶️ Marco dropped to WVC, basically the software is all lined up for that always

⏹️ ▶️ Marco on screen feature. So I think the combination of the software pointing the way there

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and the rumors to that effect for a pretty long time now, that’s probably a safe bet, I’d say. And I think that’s gonna be

⏹️ ▶️ Marco kind of fun. I mean, I’m not a phone on the table kind of person. Like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco my phone’s in my pocket when it’s not in my hand. So I don’t think the Always On Screen would be super

⏹️ ▶️ Marco useful to me personally, but I can see that would be a pretty massive feature

⏹️ ▶️ Marco for most of the world, who, you know, most of the world seems to be like this giant phone

⏹️ ▶️ Marco that doesn’t fit in my pocket, it must live on the table whenever I sit down. And so for those people, this is gonna

⏹️ ▶️ Marco be a pretty good feature, I think.

⏹️ ▶️ John I do wonder how they’ll control what you’re allowed to have on the screen, because these screens are OLED

⏹️ ▶️ John on the pro phones. You pay for every pixel that you light up. And people

⏹️ ▶️ John being people, I imagine what a lot of people want is, well, I just want to see the picture of my kids on the phone all the time.

⏹️ ▶️ John It’s like, well, the full screen, the picture of your kids, that’s a lot of pixels lit up. How about just

⏹️ ▶️ John a little tiny widget with your kids in it, right? you know, like they do on the lock screen, right? You get this

⏹️ ▶️ John little tiny rectangle and that’s where you get to put the picture of your kids. And I can imagine people saying, yeah, but on my watch

⏹️ ▶️ John I can do the whole kid’s face on the whole screen. It’s like, well, the watch screen is tiny. So I feel like there may

⏹️ ▶️ John be a tension between what technology allows in terms of the feature, you know, Apple have designed

⏹️ ▶️ John this feature to encourage you to not light up a lot of pixels and to force you perhaps to not

⏹️ ▶️ John be able to light up the entire screen and just get these little widget things. But I think that kind of flies in the face what people want

⏹️ ▶️ John from this feature. So we’ll see how this evolves over the years as the tech improves.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Well, you know, worth knowing about the lock screen widget implementation so far is that lock screen widgets

⏹️ ▶️ Marco are monochrome. And the when when you see some that have

⏹️ ▶️ Marco like a, like a kind of what appears to be like a translucent kind of background, like a glass background kind of effect.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco That is a special modifier and Swift UI. That’s it’s like the you know, the vibrancy background or something like that.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I can imagine them in a in a low luminance situation like a, you know, sleeping lock screen

⏹️ ▶️ Marco that’s always on just rendering those as black. So I think I think the aesthetic is going to be

⏹️ ▶️ Marco basically just monochrome line art for the widgets you know text and iconography

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and monochrome and that’s probably it and then that gives them the freedom to like dim it way down

⏹️ ▶️ Marco or adapt to you know different ambient light levels in a smart way so

⏹️ ▶️ Marco that’s probably how that’s going to be and so I don’t think we’re gonna see things like you know photos being used there because

⏹️ ▶️ Marco they would have to be like black and white like literally like you know, not even not even having like translucency, like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco or not even having not even grayscale, like even even grayscale is not going to look super good there.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco They could do it, but they probably won’t do it. So we’re looking at basically monochrome art style here, line

⏹️ ▶️ Marco art and text. And for that, I think they can do quite well, and have lots of

⏹️ ▶️ Marco control over it. But that will naturally limit it. Also, you know, I don’t know if you’re using the beta john, but I know Casey, you

⏹️ ▶️ Marco are the the number of widgets on the lock screen is very small. You

⏹️ ▶️ Marco basically so you have you have like the time you have above the time you have like the date

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and day of the week. And there’s like, you can put like a tiny widget next to that. So there’s one up top,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco that’s like a little skinny text thing that goes a lot, you know, in line with the date. And then below the time, you have room

⏹️ ▶️ Marco for you know, two, three or four widgets that take up one line. So you know, there’s,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco you know, there’s like medium rectangles and little circles. And you can either do four little circles, or

⏹️ ▶️ Marco one medium rectangle that’s as wide as two circles, and then one or two more circles next to it, you know, so whatever it is, like, it’s

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it’s only like the top third of the screen. And even in that area, it’s a fairly small

⏹️ ▶️ Marco number of elements that you’re actually, you know, keeping there. Plus, the widget system itself is very much

⏹️ ▶️ Marco based on like, you know, pre rendering a timeline. So these apps aren’t actually being kept running this whole time. So

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it, they can make it pretty low power in a very similar way that watch complications are done.

⏹️ ▶️ John And speaking of the lock screen being monochrome stuff like it’s not it’s not as if the screen is monochrome. And it’s not as if there’s is any

⏹️ ▶️ John particular power benefit to doing things monochromatically. In fact, it may be worse because

⏹️ ▶️ John you got to light up all the RGB subpixels to get grayish. But it’s like Marco said before, when you

⏹️ ▶️ John have something that is monochrome, that means it’s also high contrast because it’s black and then

⏹️ ▶️ John not black. And that means you can dim it down and it can still be legible with the screen dimmed.

⏹️ ▶️ John Whereas if you had something that had subtle shading gradations and was basically colored like any other interface thing that Apple

⏹️ ▶️ John does where everything is is like, how about light gray miniature text on a white background?

⏹️ ▶️ John If you dim that at all, it becomes invisible. I would argue it’s already kind of invisible to old people, but

⏹️ ▶️ John Apple’s line between here’s how the designer with very good

⏹️ ▶️ John vision thinks it should look, and then here’s how it looks with the accessibility bolding thing turned on,

⏹️ ▶️ John I feel like there’s a medium between those two, which is here’s how it can still

⏹️ ▶️ John be relatively attractive, because a lot of times I feel like the accessibility mode where the high contrast

⏹️ ▶️ John and stuff just does not look as good as the real one. So I would like to be higher contrast, but

⏹️ ▶️ John still attractive, and Apple hasn’t quite found that yet. So maybe this lock screen will be

⏹️ ▶️ John one of the first interfaces they’ve done that is both high contrast in normal mode,

⏹️ ▶️ John let’s say, or in default mode, but still

⏹️ ▶️ John attractive looking. We’ll see.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, I would also say, if you think about the world that will be

⏹️ ▶️ Marco in a few weeks, where lots of people have these phones, and again, assuming these rumors are all real, which

⏹️ ▶️ Marco they are pretty consistent about this. So assuming this world comes to pass, imagine if you’re at

⏹️ ▶️ Marco a crowded table, maybe in a meeting or at a restaurant or something, you’re at a crowded table

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and everyone has their phone on the table, you don’t want everyone’s phone to be blaring a full

⏹️ ▶️ Marco color screen at you the whole time. That would be very visually loud and very distracting.

⏹️ ▶️ John You say you in that sentence, you don’t want. Apple doesn’t want, people probably

⏹️ ▶️ John do want, but Apple is going to stop them from

⏹️ ▶️ Marco doing that. Well, good, because if you think about how they’re probably going to do it, which is a very

⏹️ ▶️ Marco subtle monochrome, low brightness, no to minimal color,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco just a very, like a status display, as if it’s like an LCD alarm or an LED alarm clock,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco very dim, just here’s a little bit of information for you on your phone, and then

⏹️ ▶️ Marco once you pick it up, then it all lights up in full color. Like, that’s fine, but as it’s sitting there idle on

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the table, you wouldn’t want a whole bunch of phones on the table to all be glowing with bright colors and bright,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and bright, high brightness.

⏹️ ▶️ John People just want their phone to have a full color picture of their kid and everyone else’s phone to be dim.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Right, so anyway, I’m thinking that’s probably gonna be like a very pragmatic

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and visually tasteful way to do it.

⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah, so continuing with the phone, I was very so the six gigs of RAM there’s a rumor with that is gonna come with

⏹️ ▶️ John a 30 or it will you will have Available to you a 30 watt charger, but but the rumor is that

⏹️ ▶️ John the phone the iPhone 14 will only be able to take 27 Watt so it’s a little bit of a future-proof charger

⏹️ ▶️ John if maybe for the 15 Better battery life is always rumor for phones in

⏹️ ▶️ John this case the better battery life would come from two main things. I think One is the lower power screen

⏹️ ▶️ John that we just talked about although that is somewhat offset by the fact that there may be an option to leave it always on with the screen

⏹️ ▶️ John we just talked about. And two is the lower power cell modem. It is not Apple’s cell

⏹️ ▶️ John modem this year, it is still another one from Qualcomm, but apparently it does not take

⏹️ ▶️ John as much power as the previous one did, which makes sense because 5G was young in the past, in the first few phones that had 5G,

⏹️ ▶️ John now the Qualcomm chips that do 5G, 5G are not quite as power hungry. So that bodes

⏹️ ▶️ John well for battery life, assuming everything else is the same. We think the phone is gonna be basically the same size, and so,

⏹️ ▶️ John you know, it should have pretty good battery life. But the other factor is the even bigger

⏹️ ▶️ John camera, it’s not even a bump, the even bigger camera mesa, camera monstrosity

⏹️ ▶️ John that’s on the back of this thing. Even bigger than the 13 in terms of sticking out of the phone, which is what

⏹️ ▶️ John I care about. I think it may also be bigger in terms of width and height, but already in the 13, it

⏹️ ▶️ John is not in the corner of the 13. It crosses the midline, it’s huge. They really need to revise this.

⏹️ ▶️ John The rumor was that this was gonna be the year where they were going to have a flat back on a thing with the periscope lens. Nope,

⏹️ ▶️ John that rumor has moved to next year. I really hope it’s true for next year. I wish it was true for the phone year that I was getting, but

⏹️ ▶️ John apparently it’s not. But anyway, in that giant camera bump that sticks out even farther, it’s got

⏹️ ▶️ John a 48 megapixel 1X camera, which will most of the time be pixel binned to 12 megapixel. So it’s

⏹️ ▶️ John not actually like you’re gonna be taking 48 megapixel photos most of the time in low light, but

⏹️ ▶️ John in theory you could in very sunny conditions take a 48 megapixel image.

⏹️ ▶️ John Also in theory, it may be able to record at 8K given the size of the sensor,

⏹️ ▶️ John we’ll see what Apple does with that because just because the sensor has 48 megapixels on it,

⏹️ ▶️ John doesn’t mean that Apple ever has to advertise or use those 48 megapixels. They could just say,

⏹️ ▶️ John you know, it’s got 48 megapixels, but we pixel bin all the time, and that’s a great advantage and only Apple, blah, blah, blah.

⏹️ ▶️ John I’m interested to see how they market this. Can you explain what pixel binning is? So pixel binning

⏹️ ▶️ John is when you have a, you know, have a 48 megapixel camera, but instead of reading out each pixel saying, okay,

⏹️ ▶️ John pixel, what color do you see? Okay, pixel, what other color do you see? You take a set of four pixels, a two by two

⏹️ ▶️ John square of pixels, and you treat that as one big pixel, because that square

⏹️ ▶️ John of four pixels is very large compared to the size of the single pixel. And so you get basically,

⏹️ ▶️ John in the current camera, so you get basically a 12 megapixel camera, I guess 48 divided by four is 12.

⏹️ ▶️ John You get a 12 megapixel camera, where each quote unquote pixel on the sensor is actually four 48

⏹️ ▶️ John megapixel size sensors. That’s pixel binning. I think I got the right term, right? Am I using the wrong term

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco for it?

⏹️ ▶️ John I believe so, yeah. Yeah, it’s not the same as binning with the Silicon Graphics, but anyway,

⏹️ ▶️ John it’s using four pixels. It’s kind of like retina, the retina of the sensor, you know, it’s the same thing on a retina

⏹️ ▶️ John screen where you have a one on-screen point is made up of four native resolution

⏹️ ▶️ John pixels on your screen. So there are a lot of things Apple can do programmatically with

⏹️ ▶️ John this sensor to do fancy stuff with cameras. We don’t know which of those things they’re going to choose to do,

⏹️ ▶️ John other than surely they will support pixel binning. But they could also say, well, when there’s enough light, we’ll use 48 megapixels,

⏹️ ▶️ John maybe we’ll use some weird hybrid thing where the regions of the photo that have enough light will use like the native pixels and the

⏹️ ▶️ John other ones will be binned, who knows? Like computational photography is the type of thing that tends not to

⏹️ ▶️ John leak because it’s software. We just know the hardware. Also, rumor is the

⏹️ ▶️ John bigger pixels on the ultra wide camera that are twice as large as the pixels were on the iPhone 13 Pro,

⏹️ ▶️ John and that bodes well for light gathering. This is the 0.5 X camera, the really, really wide

⏹️ ▶️ John one. I haven’t heard any rumors about the three X camera or whatever. We call that camera. That’s not the

⏹️ ▶️ John ultra wide and not the quote unquote one X. Will it be three X? Will it be two point five, three point five? I think I

⏹️ ▶️ John recall seeing rumors about that, but I didn’t find them in time for the show, so we’ll see what that is. But I would imagine it will

⏹️ ▶️ John continue to be like it is today. But the one X camera is better and the zoomed in

⏹️ ▶️ John camera doesn’t zoom in enough to be satisfactory for anybody, but also takes worse pictures.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco sounds about right. Yeah, like I’m very, very interested to see what this,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco you know, allegedly 48 megapixel main sensor does, like how that works, you know, because that’s,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco you know, as john john covered it well, but that’s going to produce some very tiny pixels, because this

⏹️ ▶️ Marco is not a very large sensor, like physically, so

⏹️ ▶️ John very tiny pixels and a lot of noise, which is why they do the binning because as the pixels get very, very small, it’s easy

⏹️ ▶️ John for them to be deterred, perturbed and to think, I’m not sure what light I got, but I think I might be 100%

⏹️ ▶️ John red. And you’re like, no, Pixel, you’re not 100% red. And so that’s why you get noise at, quote unquote, high

⏹️ ▶️ John ISO on camera sensors, because they don’t get, you need a certain amount of light to get into

⏹️ ▶️ John the pixel on the sensor for it to take an accurate reading. And if you just barely get a little bit of light in there,

⏹️ ▶️ John the camera sensor’s like, I don’t know, like greenish, I guess?

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco And you get noise. You get

⏹️ ▶️ John noise in the form of sort of pixels in the image that you know didn’t exist in the world when you look out there.

⏹️ ▶️ John And that’s why sometimes you need to bin them, because if you get four of those pixels together and you say, okay, let me

⏹️ ▶️ John just see what all four of you saw, and one of them thinks it saw 100% red, the other one’s like, no, I think it’s kind of

⏹️ ▶️ John grayish, you can kind of, again, through computation, figure out, all right, how do I interpret the

⏹️ ▶️ John noisy signal from these four pixels on the sensor to make one pixel that we think represents what the sensor

⏹️ ▶️ John actually

⏹️ ▶️ Marco saw? Yeah, and that’s what I think this is most likely about. And I think it is possible

⏹️ ▶️ Marco that they won’t even necessarily market it as 48 megapixels. They might come up

⏹️ ▶️ Marco with some new term that’s like, you know, like we’re beyond, like this is our new gigapixel

⏹️ ▶️ Marco camera. You know, like they’ll come up with some new name for marketing that gets rid of the number

⏹️ ▶️ Marco of megapixels because they don’t want to talk about that anymore because it’s more complicated than that now.

⏹️ ▶️ John And to be clear, this is not a new thing at all. Cameras have been doing this forever.

⏹️ ▶️ John Phone cameras have been doing this for a long, this is just what Apple’s doing this year And Apple likes to

⏹️ ▶️ John have their own brand names for things. And it’s good. It’s like we’re not saying it’s bad, but don’t think this is. When Apple introduces

⏹️ ▶️ John things like this, very often if you don’t know about this technology, you think, wow, this is amazing. No one has ever done this before. No,

⏹️ ▶️ John people have done this before.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco That being said, I do expect that if they were doing something like this, I do expect it to be

⏹️ ▶️ Marco some kind of significant advancement to the abilities of the computational engine. Because

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it’ll be getting more information. And with more information, it can create better outcomes. So I’m guessing

⏹️ ▶️ Marco that’s gonna be how we see this. Like it’s not gonna necessarily be that our output number of pixels is

⏹️ ▶️ Marco going to necessarily be that. It might be, but it probably won’t be. My guess is we’re gonna get

⏹️ ▶️ Marco a better quality 12 megapixel size than what we had before through

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the use of more pixels as input to the algorithm. But we’ll see, I could be wrong.

⏹️ ▶️ John I’m still holding out hope that they’ll, like if on a sunny day you take a picture, that they’re actually gonna give you the full 48 megapixels

⏹️ ▶️ John because there’s just so much sunlight.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I mean, maybe that would be great, but this is a really tiny sensor,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John so I don’t know. It’ll

⏹️ ▶️ John probably still be new. We’ll see what they do. Yeah, I’m looking forward to

⏹️ ▶️ John any advancement of the camera, and I think to go along with this, the A16 is probably the only chip

⏹️ ▶️ John that has an image processor that can grind through 48 native pixels

⏹️ ▶️ John off the sensor in the time envelope required to do all the things they wanted to do with video recording

⏹️ ▶️ John and everything. So, you know, obviously the non-pro phone is not

⏹️ ▶️ John getting this 48 megapixel camera, and I think it just, it couldn’t use it anyway because it only has the A15. So

⏹️ ▶️ John it seems like the A16 is probably the minimum SOC spec for this camera.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, that would make sense.

⏹️ ▶️ John More rumors, stronger MagSafe magnets in the phone. I mean, I suppose,

⏹️ ▶️ John you know, I don’t know if that’s true or not, but these rumors are getting less and less reliable as they go down this

⏹️ ▶️ John list, by the way. For Casey, one of the rumors that people really wanna believe, and I bet Casey wants to

⏹️ ▶️ John believe it too is vapor chamber cooling, which is basically,

⏹️ ▶️ John what you need to know about it is a better way of cooling the phone. What it actually is, is kind of like, if you’ve ever seen like

⏹️ ▶️ John a heat pipe where there’s like a liquid in there that evaporates and then goes someplace else and condenses and that’s how

⏹️ ▶️ John it carries heat away from the thing that’s hot. A vapor chamber is just like that, but instead of being in a tube, instead

⏹️ ▶️ John of being a long skinny tube, it’s a large region where the stuff can evaporate

⏹️ ▶️ John and then condense and come back in. Anyway, whole point is better cooling. The

⏹️ ▶️ John iPhone 13 Pro, not that people really care about this or regular people care about

⏹️ ▶️ John this, but people who have heavily benchmarked the 13 Pro have shown that it thermal throttles a lot more even than

⏹️ ▶️ John previous phones did. Obviously, iPhones have no fan in them, and especially when they’re

⏹️ ▶️ John in 20 layers of case, there’s not a lot of place for the heat to go. So whatever Apple can do tech-wise in the

⏹️ ▶️ John very limited space available to it, to more efficiently carry heat away from the hot parts of the

⏹️ ▶️ John phone and dump it into the less hot parts of the phone, to the extent that they can succeed in that way,

⏹️ ▶️ John they may actually help with Casey’s dimming screen in the sun. Now, there’s limited amount

⏹️ ▶️ John they can do. If you leave your phone in the dashboard out of your car, it’s gonna overheat and show you

⏹️ ▶️ John that little sad graphic that says, sorry, you can’t do anything on your phone now because it’s too darn hot. Like, there’s no getting around that.

⏹️ ▶️ John You know, it’s just physics in terms of how many watts of power are dissipated and where those things have

⏹️ ▶️ John to go. But I would love to see a better cooling solution for iPhones. I’m just not sure

⏹️ ▶️ John I’m willing to believe that all the rumors have been, Apple is investigating vapor chamber cooling. I

⏹️ ▶️ John bet they’ve been investigating vapor chamber cooling for the past 10 years for iPhones. It doesn’t mean it’s going to come

⏹️ ▶️ John in this phone, but fingers crossed.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, agreed. And just to be clear, what I was complaining about before, I do

⏹️ ▶️ Casey every once in a while see the, you can’t use your phone until it cools down message. That’s not what I’m talking about. What I’m talking

⏹️ ▶️ Casey about is you can use the phone, but the screen has dimmed aggressively.

⏹️ ▶️ John You’re on your way to that graphic though.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep, yep, yep. Exactly. So yeah, I would love this, you know, if it would lead

⏹️ ▶️ Casey to me being able to use my phone more consistently in sunshine, but I’m

⏹️ ▶️ Casey also not holding my breath on this one.

⏹️ ▶️ John And for my wife, there is a rumor of a new MagSafe battery pack accessory, which would

⏹️ ▶️ John kind of negate the advantage that I talked about before. It’s like, well, they introduced this MagSafe battery pack, but the good thing is

⏹️ ▶️ John you don’t need to get rid of it. You can use it with your next phone. But if Apple comes out with a better MagSafe battery pack, a lot of people are gonna say,

⏹️ ▶️ John oh, well forget about this old MagSafe battery pack. It’s old anyway, let me get the new one. So we’ll see how that goes. And then the

⏹️ ▶️ John final rumor, as far as this list that I compiled here for the phone, is related to the graphic

⏹️ ▶️ John for the invitation, which says Far Out and shows an Apple logo surrounded by stars and like a space

⏹️ ▶️ John star field. We had this rumor, I think, last year, maybe even the year before that as well. Satellite

⏹️ ▶️ John connectivity for iPhones. I really don’t think this

⏹️ ▶️ John is the year for it, but it’s been rumored for like two or three years now. Maybe it will happen

⏹️ ▶️ John someday. I always, when I see these rumors, I think, oh, I’m sure the company that owns those satellites would love

⏹️ ▶️ John for an Apple tie-in for its service. I’m just not entirely sure that it is a real thing

⏹️ ▶️ John or what its function might be. But when we get to the Apple Watch rumors, we’ll see there may be a connection that will make

⏹️ ▶️ John sense there. And hey, the invitation does have stars on it this year, but I wouldn’t read too much into it. We’ll see,

⏹️ ▶️ John it’s a possibility. There it is at the bottom of the list, satellite connectivity.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Wouldn’t it make more sense if this was when Apple starts using their own modems? Like, maybe

⏹️ ▶️ Casey I’m dead wrong about that, but it seems logical to me that it would make a lot more

⏹️ ▶️ John sense. Oh, that they would wait till their own modems for the satellite thing? I don’t know. I mean, I think the part of this rumor

⏹️ ▶️ John is that the hardware is capable of it right now, or the hardware in the iPhone 14 Pro is capable of

⏹️ ▶️ John satellite connectivity. It just doesn’t mean that that’s a thing it will be

⏹️ ▶️ John in the product.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I mean, if it is, that’s an incredible feature. Like that’s a very, very compelling feature

⏹️ ▶️ Marco for lots of people who, you know, take their phones or live in, you know, in or around

⏹️ ▶️ Marco places that have crappy cell coverage or no cell coverage.

⏹️ ▶️ John It’s incredibly compelling feature for people who own satellites that are in space that can provide this because they

⏹️ ▶️ John would love some iPhone customers money. Because to be clear, this is not a thing that you’ll just get for free.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco No one and the way it’s been rumored, which is which makes sense, is that it would basically

⏹️ ▶️ Marco be for emergency use only. Like so and Garmin sells these little in-reach

⏹️ ▶️ Marco devices that are basically do the same thing now, where you can,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it’s connected to a satellite network, and it’s meant to like, you know, bring with you if you’re going camping in the mountains or something, and you’re going to

⏹️ ▶️ Marco be like, nowhere near cell coverage. Well, what if you have some kind of emergency, and you need to call for help? That’s

⏹️ ▶️ Marco what these are for. So you can’t place like a voice call on it, but you can like send a text

⏹️ ▶️ Marco message, or you can hit like an SOS button and it’ll transmit your location to responders. That kind

⏹️ ▶️ Marco of thing is very, very compelling. So you’re not gonna be browsing Instagram over

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the satellite network. There’s no data functionality on these things, or

⏹️ ▶️ Marco at least very, very, very minimal data functionality. It’s only for sending emergency messages,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco basically, and calling for help if you need it. And so the rumor is that Apple has been negotiating with

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the provider of this, the big company that makes these satellites, to have some kind of level of emergency service

⏹️ ▶️ Marco for iPhone owners. And if that’s the case, that’s first of all, that’s a pretty big if, because that’s a very

⏹️ ▶️ Marco big deal and involving different people and very large volumes.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco But if that is a thing, that’s massive. And that would be a huge driver

⏹️ ▶️ Marco of sales for whatever model would have it, because a lot of people want to

⏹️ ▶️ Marco have some kind of emergency coverage when they’re out of cell coverage areas. And that’s a pretty great feature.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah,

⏹️ ▶️ John and we had this exact discussion last year for the 13 and it didn’t ship. And it’s not

⏹️ ▶️ John like it didn’t ship because the iPhone didn’t have the tech for it. It’s like they didn’t make the business deal. Because you got it, like Apple doesn’t own

⏹️ ▶️ John satellites, so they have to make a deal with somebody who does. And it would be a cool Apple thing to do for Apple to say,

⏹️ ▶️ John actually this is free for iPhone owners. Apple will pay this company some flat amount or whatever.

⏹️ ▶️ John And in exchange for that, any iPhone user, if they need it, can use it in the case of emergency or whatever, you know, because it’s

⏹️ ▶️ John an infrequent feature. but we’ll say maybe this is the year for that

⏹️ ▶️ Marco feature. And honestly, I could see that being the way to do it because otherwise, like, I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco mean, they would have to have some kind of like billing system. I mean, I guess they could make it like part of, you know, Apple Plus

⏹️ ▶️ Marco or Apple One or whatever, but, you know, I can imagine them just saying

⏹️ ▶️ Marco like, no, look, this is just included for free with every iPhone is, you know, emergency

⏹️ ▶️ Marco calling if you need it with satellite. Yeah.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Can we go back just a half step to the battery pack? If you recall, the

⏹️ ▶️ Casey three of us decided during a recording like a year ago, whenever it came out, that I was going to be the one

⏹️ ▶️ Casey to take the fall and spend $100 or whatever the ridiculous amount was on the

⏹️ ▶️ Casey battery pack. And I did. And I slightly, oh, you did? I don’t

⏹️ ▶️ Casey think I knew that.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I got it like later on. I didn’t get it when it was new.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Okay, so I did, I spent the money, I got the battery pack.

⏹️ ▶️ John And my wife’s got it too, so all three of us have it.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey As it turns out, although I was the first one to take the fall. I remember vividly, I was given that homework assignment And I thought, you

⏹️ ▶️ Casey know what? If I’m gonna get a homework assignment to spend a pile of money, I will spend $100 pile or

⏹️ ▶️ Casey a $100 size pile of money and be okay with that. But anyways, I bought this thinking I would use it twice, never look back.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey That thing is actually really convenient and I really like it. Like I’m not saying you have to buy the $100 Apple version cause there are other

⏹️ ▶️ Casey third-party versions that do the same idea. But I actually really like having

⏹️ ▶️ Casey a Qi and MagSafe battery pack that you can just slap on a phone for

⏹️ ▶️ Casey a little while or for even several hours, charge the phone, and then just pop it right off, and you don’t

⏹️ ▶️ Casey have to think about it again. It is actually way more convenient than I expected. And a surprise

⏹️ ▶️ Casey hit in the LIS household. You know, every great once in a while, because we have Qi chargers on our bedside tables, we do not

⏹️ ▶️ Casey have MagSafe chargers on our bedside tables. And every great once in a while, one of us will miss, and

⏹️ ▶️ Casey we think the thing is charging. In fact, this happened to Aaron last night. We think the thing is charging, but it turns out, you know,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey it isn’t. And so you wake up in the morning, your phone’s at like 10, 20, 30%. Well,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey as long as we keep that battery pack charged, which we tend to do, which I know is terrible for the battery, but whatever, as

⏹️ ▶️ Casey long as we keep it charged, and you can slap that bad boy on there and go about your day and not have to worry about it, which is really, really

⏹️ ▶️ Casey convenient. So again, I’m not necessarily advocating the Apple one specifically, but

⏹️ ▶️ Casey the whole idea of a Qi and MagSafe powered battery pack, two thumbs up from

⏹️ ▶️ Casey the List household.

⏹️ ▶️ John And the rumor about a new one, the things they could do with the new one to make it better is make the battery bigger,

⏹️ ▶️ John as in bigger capacity, maybe also visit Frasier’s site on

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco YouTube

⏹️ ▶️ John and make it attach more securely. And so that fits with the potentially stronger MagSafe rumor. So I’m hoping that’s the

⏹️ ▶️ John case because the current one is not up to the rigors of Pokemon Go. No, it is not.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I just, I wish that there was a better way to charge than Qi

⏹️ ▶️ Marco for these battery packs. Cause you know, like right now we have two options. We can either use Qi, which is

⏹️ ▶️ Marco a MagSafe, which is very convenient, but performs horribly. or

⏹️ ▶️ Marco we can use a cabled battery pack, which is very inconvenient and

⏹️ ▶️ Marco bulkier, but charges much faster and more efficiently and with less heat. You know, because

⏹️ ▶️ Marco a Qi battery pack, you figure like, if you’re using a, you know, a little battery pack for your phone,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco size is important, charging speed is probably important if you don’t want to keep it on there

⏹️ ▶️ Marco all day long. And you were literally, Casey, just complaining about a

⏹️ ▶️ Marco heat issue with

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey your phone, right? And

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Qi is horrible for all those things. It is incredibly slow, it’s inefficient,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it loses lots of its power to heat in the process, which means both that your phone and pocket are hotter,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and the same size battery pack, you’re not getting as much power out of it, you know,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco as much capacity out of it as you would if it was directly wired. So really, Qi is terrible for the performance

⏹️ ▶️ Marco characteristics. It just happens to be really convenient. I wish there was something, and I don’t think they would ever

⏹️ ▶️ Marco do this, but I almost wish there was something like the iPad smart connector

⏹️ ▶️ Marco where there were like a couple of contact dots on the back of the phone

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John and

⏹️ ▶️ Marco a compatible accessory could directly charge with contacts,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco maybe using MagSafe to align it, but having like little contacts in the back that they could just use

⏹️ ▶️ Marco little holes

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John there. It

⏹️ ▶️ John sounds like what you want is not MagSafe, but MagSafe. Right. Right. Right.

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco Stupid Apple names.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John Exactly

⏹️ ▶️ Marco like that, you know, some kind of Matt, you know, yeah, MagSafe with contacts would

⏹️ ▶️ Marco be incredible because it could charge things with much more current. So much faster charging

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and with much less heat and power loss. And again, I don’t see them doing this

⏹️ ▶️ Marco for a number of reasons, you know, aesthetic, uh, the issues of going through cases like, you know,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I, I don’t think they’re going to do it, but I wish they would because because MagSafe for like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco alignment and stickiness is great, but Qi as a charging method sucks.

⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah, the thing that will solve this medium to longish term is that,

⏹️ ▶️ John you know, assuming the advances in battery technology that are on the horizon actually come to

⏹️ ▶️ John fruition in the next few decades, we should be able to get in a phone size device

⏹️ ▶️ John enough battery power to be, you know, even better than what we have today to get you through the day with

⏹️ ▶️ John a phone caliber SOC and basically have many

⏹️ ▶️ John fewer watt hours to do that. So as chip technology advances, as the batteries get better, whatever,

⏹️ ▶️ John even if the charging technology doesn’t get that much better it’s kind of the same way that the watch charges so fast that

⏹️ ▶️ John you can just put it on the charger when you take a shower and then you can sleep with it all night. It’s because the watch battery is so small. It

⏹️ ▶️ John has a small amount of energy in it. So to the extent that we can shrink the battery in the phone by saying,

⏹️ ▶️ John we don’t need the battery to have as much energy stored in it because the computing

⏹️ ▶️ John stuff in the rest of the phone requires less energy to be a phone caliber SoC,

⏹️ ▶️ John that will let us get to the point where this wireless charging stuff is less onerous. Not

⏹️ ▶️ John through any amazing advance in wireless charging technology, not through any advance

⏹️ ▶️ John in connectors, like the direct connection and things, but simply in, I don’t have to put as much energy into this

⏹️ ▶️ John battery because the phone requires less energy. This is, you know, it’s not an infinite timeline argument, but it is a

⏹️ ▶️ John decades long argument. That seems more lively to me than some kind of advance

⏹️ ▶️ John in wireless charging technology that makes it not have all the downsides you just talked about. Because practically

⏹️ ▶️ John speaking, the way we’re doing wireless charging is the way, you know, it’s electromagnetism to get energy from

⏹️ ▶️ John one place to another. And the farther you separate them and the more energy you have to put, like there’s no getting around

⏹️ ▶️ John that stuff, right? I don’t think there’s any thing on the horizon that’s going to allow us to wirelessly charge

⏹️ ▶️ John at longer distances and higher power without all the downsides of

⏹️ ▶️ John heat and inefficiencies and all the stuff we don’t like.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey You know, it’s funny, I had said to you that Erin was using the battery pack this morning because her phone got

⏹️ ▶️ Casey a little off kilter last night on the charger. And she had her phone in her purse while we went out to

⏹️ ▶️ Casey breakfast for her birthday today, actually. And she pulled her phone out of her purse after it had been sitting there half

⏹️ ▶️ Casey an hour, an hour, or something like that. And the very first thing she said was, oh, my phone is on fire.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John Like, and

⏹️ ▶️ Casey obviously not literally, But you know, it was just really fricking hot. And that’s because of the Qi charging,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey like you were saying, Marco, and the fact that the battery pack was creating, and then the phone together were

⏹️ ▶️ Casey creating so much darn heat.

⏹️ ▶️ John So this is another disappointing thing with the non-Pro 14,

⏹️ ▶️ John is that historically the non-Pro phones have been the type of thing

⏹️ ▶️ John where like, if you don’t care about the maximum possible power and all that other stuff, you could potentially get better

⏹️ ▶️ John battery life from the non-pro phone in these years when they’ve been the same form factor, same size battery

⏹️ ▶️ John and everything, just because they run less hot, they are doing less stuff or whatever. Well, this year,

⏹️ ▶️ John I mean, maybe it’s not that bad because I think the A16 and the A15 are built on the same process, I think.

⏹️ ▶️ John But anyway, the iPhone non-pro 14 is not going to have a new

⏹️ ▶️ John SoC that uses less power. It’s going to have the same old A15 as in the phones

⏹️ ▶️ John now. In fact, the same A15 as in the iPhone 13, because it’s coming from a year

⏹️ ▶️ John when both phones had the good SoC, which is kind of disappointing. In theory,

⏹️ ▶️ John it could still use less power because of the more power-sipping Qualcomm cell

⏹️ ▶️ John modem that I think will also be in the 14. And maybe, I’m not sure about the

⏹️ ▶️ John low power screen thing or whatever, but this just, if this becomes the way things are, I mean, if

⏹️ ▶️ John it had always been this way, we would have just accepted it, oh, well, the Pro phone has the fancy SoC and the non-pro one is the old one. But because

⏹️ ▶️ John we were spoiled by those years when they both had the same SoC, it is disappointing to go back to this tiered world and it

⏹️ ▶️ John makes the non-pro phone ever so slightly less attractive. Maybe that will be adjusted

⏹️ ▶️ John by the rumored price increases across the board. So it’s like, well, I was gonna get the pro phone, but look at these prices. I don’t care about that

⏹️ ▶️ John camera that much. So we’ll see how Apple positions this. Obviously the big win for non-pro people

⏹️ ▶️ John is, hey, if you wanted a big phone but didn’t wanna pay pro prices, this is a huge upgrade. I can’t believe

⏹️ ▶️ John Apple waited so long to produce a big iPhone for the people who want it that’s not

⏹️ ▶️ John a pro phone. I think that is filling a big hole in their line. I would say that they’re gonna

⏹️ ▶️ John sell a lot of them, but I don’t actually know how many people buy the Max’s at all. And I

⏹️ ▶️ John think it’s a little bit of an unknown because the Max phone, the biggest phone, has always been Apple’s

⏹️ ▶️ John most expensive phone for the entire history that the giant phone has existed in their lineup.

⏹️ ▶️ John So we don’t know what it’s gonna be like. How many people were buying that because they always wanted the most expensive phone How many people

⏹️ ▶️ John just want a big screen phone and will get the cheapest big screen phone they can buy? And that happened to be it. So

⏹️ ▶️ John this will be a fun experiment for Apple’s bean counters to see how this goes. But I think no matter what,

⏹️ ▶️ John it’s not like they’re gonna do this and say, oh, it was a terrible mistake, let’s roll it back next year. I think this should just be the

⏹️ ▶️ John way going forward. I mean, if only just for Sentry, which Apple loves, like 14 and 14 Pro,

⏹️ ▶️ John they both come in two sizes. Very, very easy to explain.

Apple Watch Series 8 rumors

⏹️ ▶️ Casey All right, what else?

⏹️ ▶️ John Apple watch series 8 the rumors about that are hey super boring. It’s kind of like

⏹️ ▶️ John the series 7 Maybe you’ll have a temperature sensor. Maybe it’ll come in a new color or two

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco Yeah, we’ve heard like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco basically nothing about like the whatever the regular version of the series 8 is supposed to be

⏹️ ▶️ Marco We’ve only heard rumors about this like larger, you know, possibly more rugged one

⏹️ ▶️ John well the Temperature sensor is the main rumor for the non for the plane

⏹️ ▶️ John and you may be wondering we’re talking we get that we get to a But anyway for the plain old Apple series Apple watch series 8

⏹️ ▶️ John temperature sensor is the rumor It’s that one of those type of things that Apple has at various times

⏹️ ▶️ John They’ve been rumors about new health sensors or take capabilities that have Either not

⏹️ ▶️ John launched when we thought they were going to or launch with less capability than the rumors said So we’ll see

⏹️ ▶️ John how this goes. The rumor now is that yes, it will have a temperature sensor, but you won’t be able to say Hey Apple watch what’s my

⏹️ ▶️ John body temperature right now instead? It’ll just because of the presumably the imprecision of it it will just take

⏹️ ▶️ John readings over the course of the day and kind of tell you what your sort of average is by sort of throwing away the garbage values

⏹️ ▶️ John and averaging it all together, presumably due to the difficulty of taking your temperature on the back of your

⏹️ ▶️ John wrist, which as you know, if you ever use a thermometer, is not one of the areas where you tend to put

⏹️ ▶️ John a thermometer to get an accurate body temperature reading. But then again, we’ve all been scammed by the stupid IR things that go

⏹️ ▶️ John in your forehead. Although I still think the forehead is a easier place to get a accurate body temperature

⏹️ ▶️ John than the back of your wrist. So it’s a difficult challenge. We’ll see if this thing ships or how they position it. But

⏹️ ▶️ John as with all health sensors, Apple tends to be cagey and say, we’re not, this watch is not your doctor.

⏹️ ▶️ John We’ll be really conservative about kind of what we say, like Margo’s fast heart rate thing. Like,

⏹️ ▶️ John we’re not gonna tell you anything deep about your heart, but we’re gonna say, we noticed something that might be a thing,

⏹️ ▶️ John here you go. Like, here’s a summary of something we noticed, but we’ll see how the

⏹️ ▶️ John temperature stuff goes. If that does ship on the Apple Watch Series 8, that was probably enough to get a

⏹️ ▶️ John lot of people on board. Presumably, the rumor of the design is it looks just like the 7, same big screen, same all that stuff.

⏹️ ▶️ John Maybe it’ll have some power improvements. I think we talked about last time that the SOC in the Apple Watch,

⏹️ ▶️ John they incremented the number, but it’s basically the same SOC as the last one with like minimal changes.

⏹️ ▶️ John I wonder if they’ll do that again.

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco think it’s about the same as the last two, actually.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John Like I think

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the Series 5, 6, and 7 have all basically had the same SOC.

⏹️ ▶️ John Even though they’ve changed the name, as you know, under the covers of people who’ve been poking around, it seems like it’s similar. So

⏹️ ▶️ John I don’t expect any big changes there. This year, the big rumor is, for whatever the hell they call this thing, let’s just call

⏹️ ▶️ John it the Apple Watch Series 8 Pro for now, but who knows what they’ll call it. The rumor is that it will

⏹️ ▶️ John be a bigger watch with a flat display that is more rugged and has longer

⏹️ ▶️ John battery life and might be made of titanium. And this is kind of like the rumor last year that all the Apple Watches

⏹️ ▶️ John are gonna have flat sides or whatever, although interestingly, the rumor for this one is that it has a flat screen. Presumably that implies

⏹️ ▶️ John flat sides as well. I’m not sure how they’ll position this other than, hey, here’s an Apple Watch

⏹️ ▶️ John that costs more money. If it actually is bigger, the rumor is 47 millimeters. And if that’s like the only

⏹️ ▶️ John size it comes in, I guess it’ll have better battery life because it’s just so much bigger.

⏹️ ▶️ John And most of the stuff that’s inside of it is battery. Titanium should make it lighter and maybe

⏹️ ▶️ John more rugged, but like the rumors have been all over the place on this. Oh, it’s gonna be a watch for hikers and explorers

⏹️ ▶️ John and you’ll be able to take it into the wilderness with you because it’s super rugged and it’s the G-Shock of Apple watches and the battery

⏹️ ▶️ John life lasts a long time and you can camp for a week with it without charging it like David Smith wants to do. And,

⏹️ ▶️ John but also it could just be, oh, this is a pro one and it’s fancier and it’s more expensive or it could be it’s the most expensive

⏹️ ▶️ John one cause it’s the biggest, like the iPhone pro max. I really don’t know, again, if

⏹️ ▶️ John this appears how they’re going to pitch this, but this seems like, I mean, I know the iPhone is the

⏹️ ▶️ John star of the show but everything we talked about on the iPhone is like, oh, it’s like last year’s phones but has some better stuff,

⏹️ ▶️ John right? This is a new product. And I know the 14 Max is also technically a new product, but this

⏹️ ▶️ John is a new product that, you know, cause Apple hasn’t, we talked about this last year with the rumors of the flat size. Apple has not changed

⏹️ ▶️ John the fundamental iconic form factor of the Apple Watch and the history of the product. It has changed

⏹️ ▶️ John in, you know, subtle ways, but it’s always been that Airstream trailer on your wrist but made of different materials,

⏹️ ▶️ John right? And it’s gotten better and better looking over time, but they haven’t changed that. If the rumors of this thing being

⏹️ ▶️ John flat and everything are true, this will be the first new design of the Apple Watch in the history of the

⏹️ ▶️ John product. It’s like as if Tesla ever redesigned the Model S. It’s like, wow, I didn’t

⏹️ ▶️ John even know that was possible. I thought it was gonna be the same car forever and ever. We’ll see if this happens,

⏹️ ▶️ John but if it does, I suppose the Pro watch that presumably will cost even more than the other

⏹️ ▶️ John ones is the place to experiment with

⏹️ ▶️ Marco this. And to be clear, and we’ll see what all this ends up being in a product

⏹️ ▶️ Marco if it comes out, but there is a fairly substantially sized market

⏹️ ▶️ Marco for larger, more rugged smartwatches that are often used for

⏹️ ▶️ Marco either extreme workout conditions or things like hiking and

⏹️ ▶️ Marco large outdoor expedition kind of things. That is a market that exists and that is being served by other

⏹️ ▶️ Marco brands right now and that the Apple Watch is not competing as well as it could in that market.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco So it actually does make tons of sense for Apple to try to get into this market. Whether they’ll

⏹️ ▶️ Marco succeed, who knows, it remains to be seen. how well this product will actually appeal to that market.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Who knows, again, it remains to be seen. This is not a market of just cheap

⏹️ ▶️ Marco crap watches. Like the watches that are in this market are in the ballpark of Apple’s prices

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and I think they might even exceed them in some cases. So it isn’t like Apple can’t

⏹️ ▶️ Marco compete just because they’re like the nice expensive option like in certain markets. No, in this case, Apple could compete

⏹️ ▶️ Marco if they choose to, they just so far have basically chosen not to. And if you look, there’s lots

⏹️ ▶️ Marco of these, these like 46, 47-ish, 50 millimeter watches that

⏹️ ▶️ Marco are very thick and chunky, like John kind of sarcastically said, like the G-Shock

⏹️ ▶️ Marco of smartwatches. But no, those are real. That’s a real category that actually exists and that is

⏹️ ▶️ Marco currently not buying Apple watches. Does the G-Shock of

⏹️ ▶️ John smartwatches exist though?

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I know Garmin makes a lot of-

⏹️ ▶️ John I mean, I guess that makes sense for Garmin, but that’s the challenge Apple faces, right? It’s

⏹️ ▶️ John thus far, it’s Apple watches have not been anywhere near the ballpark of

⏹️ ▶️ John I can take this on a week vacation without a charger, like not even close. A day or two

⏹️ ▶️ John maybe.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Right, so yeah, the battery question, that’s a very big question. And that remains to be seen,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco you know, if they try to exceed their current battery life or if they just say, you know what, if

⏹️ ▶️ Marco you’re doing multi-day off the grid adventures, this still isn’t for you. But if you’re doing something

⏹️ ▶️ Marco that’s just requires like more ruggedness, that’s fine. because ruggedness takes up space.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco So the question is, are they making a significantly bigger battery inside

⏹️ ▶️ Marco this watch, or is it a significantly larger and more bulked up body

⏹️ ▶️ Marco around what is basically a 45 millimeter Series 8 or Series 7? And I think that’s the more likely thing,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco because to make something rugged, again, you need padding. So whether it’s this gummy plastic

⏹️ ▶️ Marco kind of case for some squish resistance there, or whether

⏹️ ▶️ Marco you’re just using thicker metals, who knows. That’s why, so the rumor is that this

⏹️ ▶️ Marco might be offered in titanium as a pro high-end thing.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I don’t know if that necessarily makes sense to be this product. This, that

⏹️ ▶️ Marco sounds like, and maybe this is wishful thinking, that sounds like two different rumors that are being conflated.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Like maybe they’re gonna have, or maybe they’re gonna rebrand the Edition

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Apple Watch Pro and that stays titanium but but stays available in all the sizes

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and maybe the large rugged one is made of something else because you

⏹️ ▶️ Marco can’t imagine where you can make titanium fairly tough you know in the ballpark maybe a little

⏹️ ▶️ Marco bit tougher than steel depending on how you’re processing it and what you’re finishing it with but you know it can be pretty tough

⏹️ ▶️ Marco but it’s nothing like these these Garmin rugged watches that are mostly made of like plastic materials

⏹️ ▶️ Marco or plastic composites to be rugged, you know, look at a G-Shock. Again, G-Shocks exist

⏹️ ▶️ Marco made of metal, but most of them are made of resin and stuff, like, because it’s just stronger and it

⏹️ ▶️ Marco takes damage more gracefully. So if they’re trying to compete with that market,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I don’t see that being the same product as a quote, pro thing made of titanium.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco That, that to me is a separate market. And there’s lots of, you know, what we call tool watches

⏹️ ▶️ Marco or or utility watches in the watch world that basically means like kind of like, you know, rugged everyday things that

⏹️ ▶️ Marco if you’re like, you know, working, you know, in a condition where, you know, your watch might get hit here

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and there, that it’s strong. There are titanium uses in the watch world

⏹️ ▶️ Marco that, you know, in those roles, but they get beaten up. And, you know, they’re made to take it somewhat gracefully,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco but they do get beaten up. And I don’t know if Apple would use titanium in that way, knowing that that’s how it would be,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco you know, how it would be used. So I don’t know, we’ll see. I’m very, very curious to see

⏹️ ▶️ Marco what these rumors end up having been about, if anything.

AirPods Pro rumors

⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah, or if anything ships at all. But again, this was rumor for last year. Maybe this will be the year. And speaking of that,

⏹️ ▶️ John one final product here, AirPods Pro 2. AirPods Pro have been around for a while. There’s been

⏹️ ▶️ John rumors of a second revision of them that hasn’t appeared yet. Maybe it will be maybe this

⏹️ ▶️ John will be the year. What would the AirPods Pro 2 do? What would they have? There are

⏹️ ▶️ John a lot of rumors surrounding they’ll be the first ones capable of lossless audio through some new codec, or maybe

⏹️ ▶️ John they’ll just use improved codecs for the regular audio stuff. Presumably they would, you know,

⏹️ ▶️ John do slightly better at all the things the AirPods Pro already do, slightly better noise canceling, better battery

⏹️ ▶️ John life, all that. But the rumors are that these are not the new form factor that’s been floating around, like

⏹️ ▶️ John stemless essentially. I don’t know if that’s a real thing or just like someone’s fantasy of like, Apple should

⏹️ ▶️ John make AirPods Pros without a stem, but the rumor is that these don’t look any different than the current ones, more or less.

⏹️ ▶️ John They would just be better at it. And I think, I mean, this is kind of the problem with AirPods, we’ve talked about this before. They have such

⏹️ ▶️ John tiny batteries. And lithium ion batteries eventually wear out and they are not replaceable.

⏹️ ▶️ John And so yeah, people can continue to just buy new copies of the same product they had, but eventually

⏹️ ▶️ John Apple likes to sell you a different version that costs slightly more. And that would be the AirPods

⏹️ ▶️ John Pro 2, which probably would be slightly more expensive than the old AirPods Pro. And I think it would encourage

⏹️ ▶️ John people to upgrade because they would say, you know what? I love my AirPods Pro, but the batteries aren’t what they used

⏹️ ▶️ John to be. And I didn’t want to buy a second copy of the same product I already have, but now that there’s new

⏹️ ▶️ John ones that are slightly better in some way, I’ll buy those. So AirPods are an amazing product, whatever that rumor was, like

⏹️ ▶️ John that if AirPods were a company by itself, it would be in somewhere really high up in the Fortune 500.

⏹️ ▶️ John They’re great products. There deserves to be a version two of these for people who like little gummy things shoved in their

⏹️ ▶️ John ear holes.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey No, I couldn’t agree more. Like I was an AirPods mega fan, super fan

⏹️ ▶️ Casey from the moment I got my first set, which was not long after they originally shipped.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey And the AirPods Pro, I think I got for this past Christmas from Aaron, and they make the, assuming

⏹️ ▶️ Casey they fit in your ears, they make the original AirPods way better. Like the noise cancellation is,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey I wouldn’t say it’s so good in the sense that it’s better than other headphones noise cancellation, but it’s so good

⏹️ ▶️ Casey in the sense that it makes using the AirPods so much nicer. Because if you’re in a loud environment,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey suddenly it can become a quiet environment, and that’s so amazing. So yeah,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey I am not personally in the market for a new AirPods Pro, because mine are still only eight, nine months

⏹️ ▶️ Casey old, and their batteries are still working quite well. But I don’t want this product to be

⏹️ ▶️ Casey abandoned, and I’d very much like them to show that they are willing to keep making new ones.

⏹️ ▶️ John No fear of them abandoning. It’s just a question of, are the AirPods Pro too ready yet or not?

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, I mean, I was specifically talking about the Pros. I don’t think that AirPods, as a general idea, will be abandoned, but

⏹️ ▶️ Casey particularly the AirPods Pro. And I still think you’re right. I don’t think those will be abandoned either, but I don’t know, it’s been a couple years. It’d

⏹️ ▶️ Casey be nice to know that things are still happening.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, I have been waiting to upgrade mine because my battery life is

⏹️ ▶️ Marco getting to be pretty terrible on my AirPods, and it is kind of showing

⏹️ ▶️ Marco me, because with the exception of the battery life, my AirPod Pros still work great,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and it is kind of showing me, wow, this is kind of a crappy thing for environmentalism

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and sustainability that this product, I’m ready to replace it and basically throw it away

⏹️ ▶️ Marco solely because the batteries really need to be replaced but that they can’t because they’re too tiny and you know impractical

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and glued in and whatever else but you know so that all that aside I really hope they update

⏹️ ▶️ Marco these soon because I don’t want to buy a new pair of the current ones because they are so old

⏹️ ▶️ Marco but if Apple came out and said like hey you know we’re not gonna update in front of their year I would end up just buying another

⏹️ ▶️ Marco set because I use them so much they are such a good product. I love

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the AirPods Pro. They have made all other portable

⏹️ ▶️ Marco headphones useless to me. Like I don’t use any other portable headphones.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I only use like my big fancy headphones at my desk and I use the AirPods when I’m not at my desk

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and that’s it. The AirPods Pro. That’s it. Like and I love transparency mode. I love

⏹️ ▶️ Marco noise cancelling. I love the sound quality is is extremely good for what they are.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco And I actually like the stems. I don’t want them to go stemless. I like having the stems for lots

⏹️ ▶️ Marco of reasons. Like I think the like pressure clicking mechanism is totally

⏹️ ▶️ Marco fine, way better than like the weird ear tapping thing on the other ones.

⏹️ ▶️ John I have to say an update on that because remember I got the AirPods 3 that have the squeezy thing instead of the tapping.

⏹️ ▶️ John I do it, I continue to do it less frequently, but I still tap them sometimes. And that’s

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco like

⏹️ ▶️ John a year after I got them. And I’m kind of amazed. I thought I would just totally get over it, but like in

⏹️ ▶️ John a few moments, my body just has to tap. I liked the tap. I understand why people didn’t like it. There are pros and

⏹️ ▶️ John cons to both, but I have to say for my purposes, the tap was a little bit more convenient.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco No, you’re

⏹️ ▶️ Casey wrong. Yeah, I am on team Marco on this one. I

⏹️ ▶️ John mean, the squeeze isn’t bad, but it is harder. It requires more than the tap.

⏹️ ▶️ John I think the people didn’t like the tap, they don’t like the idea of hitting something that’s in their ear, right? Cause that’s uncomfortable, but I never

⏹️ ▶️ John found that uncomfortable the way they fit and is just so much easier to do. I mean, ideally, and they should

⏹️ ▶️ John totally do this, why can’t they have it support both? Because whatever the accelerometer that does the tap

⏹️ ▶️ John and the presser sensor for the squeezing, you can fit those both in there, right? I mean, just jam it in.

⏹️ ▶️ John Like, I would love for them to support both and for you to choose. Do you want to use one, both, neither? Like, that

⏹️ ▶️ John makes perfect sense to me, but maybe in a few years they’ll do that.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah. Anyway, yeah, so they’re a great product. There’s really not much I would

⏹️ ▶️ Marco change about them, really. So whatever Apple has updated, even if it’s fairly

⏹️ ▶️ Marco minor updates, I’ll take it because it’s already a great product that really needs very little

⏹️ ▶️ Marco to change.

AR rumors

⏹️ ▶️ John And the final final rumor the one more thing that is not really rumored for this But it’s just in the news because Apple

⏹️ ▶️ John filed a bunch of trademarks Apple did Through shell companies apparently Apple has filed for trademarks for

⏹️ ▶️ John reality one reality processor and reality Pro We think the OS is called our OS or reality

⏹️ ▶️ John OS This is where their AR VR or whatever Mahoosie thing of a bobber that someday might come out I

⏹️ ▶️ John don’t I haven’t seen any real people putting any stake in the idea that it’s going to be announced

⏹️ ▶️ John at next week’s event event. But just FYI, that continues to rumble on the background, just like the car program.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep. They’re both going to ship any day now. I swear.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco And look, it very well might be next week. But I don’t know. It just it seems

⏹️ ▶️ Marco like we’re still it’s one of those things like desktop Linux. It’s like it’s always coming out like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco next year. And I don’t know, like at some point, it probably will come out.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think I again, I think that we probably will see an AR headset or something of some kind. While

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think we will never see anything from Project Titan except maybe the new CarPlay thing. But this

⏹️ ▶️ Marco allegedly is soon and it might be and maybe

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the meaning of like the far out title of the invitation, maybe the meaning is like, hey, we’re going

⏹️ ▶️ Marco to show you something that’s kind of a preview of, you know, this is like maybe we’ll get that, you know, the rumored

⏹️ ▶️ Marco developer preview mixed AR VR headset now

⏹️ ▶️ Marco or VR only maybe now and then maybe and they’re saying, oh, and down the road, within

⏹️ ▶️ Marco two years, we’ll ship the consumer version. Who knows? It still

⏹️ ▶️ John seems more like a WWDC announcement just because it’s presumably a platform.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco It also, it seems like that might even be a different event kind of announcement.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey Like,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I don’t know if they would necessarily combine that with the iPhone event. Because the iPhone event is

⏹️ ▶️ Marco so important. They have the most attention on that. And what everybody wants to know is what’s

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the new phone? That’s what they wanna know. And they throw the watch in just because it’s convenient and it’s not that long

⏹️ ▶️ Marco usually. And AirPods can

⏹️ ▶️ John fit in there, because fine.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, AirPods are kind of, watches and AirPods are both kind of phone accessories. And so like that makes some sense.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco And you know, you can see why they do it. I can’t imagine them, unless the AR

⏹️ ▶️ Marco headset is ready for consumers, because then it would be a phone accessory, you

⏹️ ▶️ John know. A headset with no apps is ready for consumers?

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I mean, the Apple Watch launched kind of like that.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John I

⏹️ ▶️ John mean, I suppose, but like, yeah,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I mean, I don’t, I just don’t see it. I think if it was that close to being ready for

⏹️ ▶️ Marco consumers, I think we would have heard a lot more concrete rumors about it by now.

⏹️ ▶️ John We’ve had a lot of concrete rumors. Like you’ve seen the testing OS, you’ve seen the descriptions of the hardware. Like it’s just,

⏹️ ▶️ John you know, none of those things were products that were ready to ship. Like at this point, the, the headset project

⏹️ ▶️ John at Apple has been functioning for what the past five years, six years as a basically a space program

⏹️ ▶️ John inside Apple. and that lots of technologies either made for or suited to

⏹️ ▶️ John that program have, we’ve seen the benefit of them being released into our other products.

⏹️ ▶️ John All the noise canceling and directional audio, spatial audio stuff, all of the 3D engine things,

⏹️ ▶️ John all of the AR things that are in all of our phones and the LiDAR sensors and all, that is all eventually,

⏹️ ▶️ John essentially technological bounty related to the headset project.

⏹️ ▶️ John Any headset they come out with will use all of those things. and the years and years we’ve been using ARKit and

⏹️ ▶️ John all that other stuff or whatever. It’s not like that stuff is useless without a headset, but you look at that and you’re

⏹️ ▶️ John like, oh, stereoscopic vision is an Apple’s feature of their 3D engine, why

⏹️ ▶️ John would they have that? It’s just, they’re almost gonna, at a certain point, they will have literally

⏹️ ▶️ John shipped everything having to do with this headset except for the headset. The software ecosystem will be there,

⏹️ ▶️ John the sensors will be there, we’ll have all the things. I mean, we know, what was the thing that had, you take your phone and you put

⏹️ ▶️ John it in the thing and that would become your headset? Samsung did that years and

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco years ago. Oh, the cardboard

⏹️ ▶️ John thing? Yeah, or no, there was a bunch of ones where you used your phone as the display. It was like, Apple has just, unlike

⏹️ ▶️ John the car thing, which we haven’t seen anything from except for that, you know, various, that iteration of CarPlay that showed up

⏹️ ▶️ John at WWDC, we have been, like this program, even if it never ships a product,

⏹️ ▶️ John has given us lots of cool technology that has been useful in products that Apple did ship.

⏹️ ▶️ John So I don’t have a bad feeling about, I don’t know, I don’t have a sour feeling about this. Oh, they’ve

⏹️ ▶️ John been working on this for years and never shipped it. At least we’re getting good stuff from it, right? Even if it never ships. And I think

⏹️ ▶️ John probably eventually it will, but it doesn’t seem like it’s gonna be a thing for next week.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Thanks to our sponsors this week, Squarespace, Trade Coffee, and Collide. And thanks

⏹️ ▶️ Marco to our members who support us directly. You can join at slash join. and we will

⏹️ ▶️ Marco talk to you next week.

Special ending theme

⏹️ ▶️ John Now that the show is over, it’s time to give to St. Jude’s.

⏹️ ▶️ John They’re funding

⏹️ ▶️ Casey research,

⏹️ ▶️ John curing diseases.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Every year you get

⏹️ ▶️ Marco a new iPhone,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey now think about the good you’ll do when you’re funding research for

⏹️ ▶️ Casey childhood diseases. Our friends at Relay

⏹️ ▶️ Casey organize this annually. It’s time to do your part

⏹️ ▶️ Casey and give directly to

⏹️ ▶️ Marco S-T-J-U-D-E-C-H-I-L-D-R-E-N-S-R-E-S-E-A-R-H-C-H-O-S-P-I-T-A-L

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⏹️ ▶️ Casey If they’re curing diseases, fund the research

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⏹️ ▶️ Marco now.


⏹️ ▶️ Marco So I’ve been battling in my office here for the last

⏹️ ▶️ Marco few weeks. My office has had a smell.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Have you considered showering?

⏹️ ▶️ Marco It is not. It doesn’t smell like an Apple store. That’s… Yeah. We had…

⏹️ ▶️ Marco there was an object that was placed in my office that ended up having an odor

⏹️ ▶️ Marco on it. Like a cologne kind of smell. Like a very strong cologne kind of smell.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco And I realized that it was in my office for a few hours until I discovered it So I got rid

⏹️ ▶️ Marco of the object. It didn’t smell as bad when it was first there. Over the following days,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it slowly built up in my office and it just smelled overwhelmingly of like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco cologne, like 80s cologne.

⏹️ ▶️ John If the object is gone, how is it building up over time?

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I don’t know. So it was placed on an upholstered chair that I have

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John in the corner.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco It’s soaked in. My office, the reason why I sound so good

⏹️ ▶️ Marco is because my office is full of soft things. I have the upholstered

⏹️ ▶️ Marco chair, I have window curtains, I have a wall

⏹️ ▶️ Marco in front of me where most of the wall is covered in acoustic foam tiles.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco On another side of me I have a blanket that’s wrapped around a

⏹️ ▶️ Marco canvas with sound deadening foam on the inside, so it’s basically like, it looks like a big frame, like a big

⏹️ ▶️ Marco like picture of blanket that absorbs sound. And then behind me, I have a whole bunch

⏹️ ▶️ Marco of coffee shipping bags that are themselves wrapped around canvas frames with sound deadening

⏹️ ▶️ Marco foam inside them for more sound deadening. And then below me is a 5x7

⏹️ ▶️ Marco carpet, a dog bed, and well, at the moment, also a dog. And

⏹️ ▶️ Marco so my room is full of all of these soft things in

⏹️ ▶️ Marco a very small, this is a very small room. It’s eyeballing it, it looks like it’s maybe like,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco you know, maybe 8 by 10 at most. It’s a small room. You

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco need to

⏹️ ▶️ John stop talking about your small room because you keep saying, I’ve seen pictures of it. I’m in a small room, you’re not.

⏹️ ▶️ John Anyway,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco so the object was gone and the chair cushion smelled bad, but because

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it had been here for a few hours, I feel like the smell had permeated

⏹️ ▶️ Marco every soft surface in the room. Because the sound board, the sound editing

⏹️ ▶️ Marco coffee bag that was above the chair, also smelled. I took it out of the room so I could smell it independently,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and it smelled. It had the smell. And so did the couple of framed ones next to it.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco And some of this stuff… So I have one of those Instagram rugs that you can throw in the washing machine. So that’s the

⏹️ ▶️ Marco first thing I did like, all right, let me wash the rug. And like my desk sits on this

⏹️ ▶️ Marco rug. So getting the rug out from under your desk is not a small task like this. It was like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco a big job, like, you know, anyway. So lots of stuff like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco filing cabinets on the rug. Anyway, so went through all these hoops.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I first tried, you know, we don’t have great options here at the beach town for like, you know,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco gear to remove this. you know, nobody has like, you know, carpet steamers or anything, but the little corner store

⏹️ ▶️ Marco sells Febreze. So first I’m like, oh, that should work. Febreze is supposed to get rid of smells, right?

⏹️ ▶️ John Oh, you’re just masking it. I learned that.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco So first I try getting rid of the smell with Febreze. I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco go through a whole bottle of it, like all within five minutes.

⏹️ ▶️ John No, no, no, your office smells like Febreze. Yeah,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I soak the chair, I spray every one of the soft things on the wall, I spray

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the rug, I spray my chair even though it’s an Aeron like that doesn’t really have upholstery it just has

⏹️ ▶️ Marco like this mesh but spray everything because everything that could possibly hold the smell I smell I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco spray with Febreze. Now my whole office smells like freaking Febreze. So I’m like alright

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John that didn’t work

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and it’s and like and the smell like right before I did the I did the Febreze the cologne smell

⏹️ ▶️ Marco was so strong that it was like making my eyes water like it was like I had to do

⏹️ ▶️ Marco something. So then I Febreze the whole office and meanwhile this

⏹️ ▶️ Marco process started while Tiff had COVID and had temporarily lost her smell. Oh nice

⏹️ ▶️ John she thinks you’re just uh

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco losing your marbles.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m going nuts and yeah and she’s like what are you doing it doesn’t smell bad. I’m like I’m I assure you

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it smells horrendous. I think my eyes are watering and I’m like well

⏹️ ▶️ John By the way, though, that is one of the things that can be a side effect of COVID,

⏹️ ▶️ John is that things can smell and taste weird even after you’ve gotten over it, or even if you never lost

⏹️ ▶️ John your sense of taste or smell when you had it, afterwards, things can taste and smell differently

⏹️ ▶️ John to you. So it may be that you have an increased sensitivity to whatever this cologne is. Maybe you

⏹️ ▶️ John should have a third-party nose come in and say, how bad

⏹️ ▶️ John does it smell? I mean, right now, it probably does smell really bad

⏹️ ▶️ Marco of Febreze. But and by the way, this is not something that can be aired out because

⏹️ ▶️ Marco while Tiff had COVID as a precaution to try to make Adam and I not get it,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco we as I mentioned, like we were sleeping in different rooms, different sides of the house even and we had

⏹️ ▶️ Marco all of the windows open and we live on the beach where there’s tons of wind all the time.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco So the house was a wind tunnel and it’s and still like you’d still come into the room

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and you’d smell it And, you know, later on, like after we were all clear, we closed all the windows up and turned the air conditioning

⏹️ ▶️ Marco on for a few days and it was unbearable because now it’s trapped in the room. So, all right. So first,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco we, I, I, I’m like, I go on Amazon, like, all right, what the heck can I get for this? Like that, that I can get

⏹️ ▶️ Marco shipped here. Uh, you know, cause washing everything is just not, is not working. The, the

⏹️ ▶️ Marco chair, I, I can’t wash most of it. The dog bed, I washed that, like that’s, I could do that. All

⏹️ ▶️ Marco right, fine. The rug. The stuff on the walls, I can’t wash all this stuff.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco So first, based on everyone’s recommendations and Amazon reviews and everything, I tried

⏹️ ▶️ Marco a HEPA filter, an air filter, that had, I got one that had a really thick carbon

⏹️ ▶️ Marco layer on the filter, so it’ll absorb a lot of smells. It’s made for VOCs, which smells kind

⏹️ ▶️ Marco of R, I think. And then I also tried, they have these

⏹️ ▶️ Marco canisters that have mesh tops that have gel in them that is scented

⏹️ ▶️ Marco with like natural oils. It’s like, you know, pine oil. You

⏹️ ▶️ John gotta stop bringing scents into this room. Have you learned nothing? Do not add any new scents.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Well, people claim that these things work, that somehow the pine oil evaporates

⏹️ ▶️ Marco or whatever. And I’m like,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John well, look, I’m desperate.

⏹️ ▶️ John These are people whose houses all smell like air freshener.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco You know, because ordering things has, you know, a three or four day delay here, I’m like, let me just buy one of

⏹️ ▶️ Marco everything. I’ll just try. So I bought a little air filter that said it was gonna do this. you know, again, because it’s a small

⏹️ ▶️ Marco room, I don’t need a big air filter. So that was at least not too big or expensive. Little HEPA filter.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I got these, you know, little canisters and I got a couple of different sprays that were supposed to like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco neutralize odors. And oh, and I was about to leave for a couple of days. And so I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco left the two, I got two of these little like, you know, air freshening things that allegedly

⏹️ ▶️ Marco kill smells with natural oils of whatever. I got two of them. I left them both in the office with the fan

⏹️ ▶️ Marco on high and the air filter running on full blast. and I closed the door and I left for two days.

⏹️ ▶️ John Wait, wait, wait. One of the first things I would have suggested to you, and you’re always going off and doing

⏹️ ▶️ John these things without consulting us, and you really should consult us, but the thing

⏹️ ▶️ John that was sitting on an upholstered chair, right, and you got rid of the thing,

⏹️ ▶️ John is the upholstered chair still in the room? First

⏹️ ▶️ Marco thing I tried was taking the chair out of the room. Yeah, take it out of your house.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Well,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John it’s not that bad. Throw it in the

⏹️ ▶️ Marco ocean. First of all, it’s a very good chair, and they don’t make it anymore. No,

⏹️ ▶️ Casey but Marco, you already have a solution for this. As we’ve already established, there is a portion

⏹️ ▶️ Casey of your deck or under deck area that is completely weatherproof that you could have put it in.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco That’s it, anyway. So yeah, first thing I tried, I brought the chair out of the room and just let it

⏹️ ▶️ Marco sit for a while.

⏹️ ▶️ John Where did you bring it? To the room that’s next to the room? Yeah, but like- You need to

⏹️ ▶️ John get it out of the house. Because you have, look, smell is not magic. Smell comes

⏹️ ▶️ John from somewhere, whether it’s these, you know, like you said it smelled like this,

⏹️ ▶️ John you know, cologne or whatever, and that there was an object that had that smell that sat on the thing. Once the object

⏹️ ▶️ John is no longer on the house, if the smell continues to be there and get stronger, the whatever was in that thing

⏹️ ▶️ John must be in something else. You need to, if you can’t purge that thing of the smell, which is

⏹️ ▶️ John what you’ve been trying to do with various techniques, you need to get the source of the smell out of your house. And

⏹️ ▶️ John then what you have left is how much of that smell is sunken to some other stuff. But it sounds like the source

⏹️ ▶️ John of the smell is still there. Putting it in another room is not going to help. You’ve just got to burn it with fire if you can’t get the smell

⏹️ ▶️ John out of

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it. Well, it did help. Like, it helped a lot to move out of my office, just so I could tell how much

⏹️ ▶️ Marco is a problem with the chair versus how much has it soaked into everything else in the

⏹️ ▶️ Marco office. Sure enough, my office still smells. So I’m like, all right, now we’ve moved beyond the chair.

⏹️ ▶️ John But it’s still in the house. You have not moved beyond the chair. Just think of it as a video game where You can see like

⏹️ ▶️ John smell vapors, like

⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey green

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco smell vapors coming out of that chair. Yeah,

⏹️ ▶️ John you moved it out of your office so it’s not as bad as it was and it’s being dispersed into the larger room but it might still be there.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco So, after I stunk up my whole office with Febreze which

⏹️ ▶️ Marco didn’t work, it just made everything smell like Febreze. And I tried clearing that off with

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the air filter and everything

⏹️ ▶️ John else. It’s like buying a mongoose to go after the snake and then buying a lion to go after the mongoose.

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco So then I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco had these little, these canisters of gel that smell like pine or lemon or whatever.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco No,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John no!

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m like, let me open these up in here, I’ll let it run with the air filter for a couple days, I’ll come back, I’ll get rid of them,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and I’ll see if it can normalize, right? Oh my gosh, oh my gosh. So I come back, and

⏹️ ▶️ Marco now the room just smells like pine lemon cologne, Febreze. Who could have

⏹️ ▶️ Marco predicted this? Who could have predicted this? I mean, I’m like, and I hate,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I love when things smell like nothing. I consider it a luxury, like, I wear like unscented deodorant.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I like unscented laundry detergent. I don’t want scents on anything. I want

⏹️ ▶️ Marco everything unscented. So why did you bring

⏹️ ▶️ John new scents into your home? So. You brought a thing that said pine scent and you left it in the room.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco It said it would get rid of other scents so I figured I’d give it a shot. You’re replacing them with pine.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Congratulations, you’ve played yourself. Oh my word.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco So now that my room smells like cologne and pine and lemon and Febreze, Finally,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I tried this other spray I had called Zero Odor. So I tried spraying the

⏹️ ▶️ Marco cushion of the chair, like where the object was sitting, that was like the most dense part of the cologne. I tried just dousing

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it in the Zero Odor stuff. I later learned, a few minutes later, Zero Odor

⏹️ ▶️ Marco itself has a smell. They call it a tracer scent, so

⏹️ ▶️ Marco you can tell where you smell it. That’s supposed to dissipate. That’s like the stuff they put in natural gas. Right?

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Tracer scent smells quite strongly of like kind of like baby powder or bleach or something

⏹️ ▶️ Marco like that It smells very strongly and it doesn’t dissipate for a while however,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I did notice after a couple of days that it did go away

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and that the smell on the cushion was Substantially reduced so I’m like okay.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I got something that works Have you gotten rid of the pine thing almost they’re in a plastic

⏹️ ▶️ Marco bag ziplocked next

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John to me just so I could

⏹️ ▶️ John throw them out.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I they were they were outside. I brought them back in for the show, so I wouldn’t forget to mention them. They’re sitting right here next

⏹️ ▶️ Marco to the bottle of

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John zero.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Ziploc bags are air permeable. I’ve learned that. But yeah, but anyway, they were there just here

⏹️ ▶️ Marco for like an hour. But I realized, OK, the cushion was improved

⏹️ ▶️ Marco by the zero odor spray. I’m now out of zero odor. Let me order a couple of bottles more.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco So they come and I got two more bottles of it. They come

⏹️ ▶️ Marco and I spend the next few days just dousing my office in this stuff, which

⏹️ ▶️ Marco then makes my office smell Like zero odor which is not

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John does not have zero odor

⏹️ ▶️ Marco isn’t it sounds like it’s non zero odor. Oh my yeah It’s definitely significant odor for a little

⏹️ ▶️ Marco while But then I at least know there’s an end to it like it ends in a couple days should be forced to rename

⏹️ ▶️ John their product to rendezvous Wow, that’s a deep cut.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Anyway, so eventually though, it did work. And meanwhile, so every

⏹️ ▶️ Marco night, like, you know, the air filter is loud as hell, but every night I’m, like, when

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I leave my office, I turn the air filter on maximum and close the door and just let it run itself

⏹️ ▶️ Marco overnight, like, just filtering everything. As far as I can tell, the air filter seems to be doing nothing because it’s just circulating

⏹️ ▶️ Marco clean air that is still having smell being emitted into it constantly by whatever. Anyway, so I zero

⏹️ ▶️ Marco odor a few more times. I deplete both bottles that I bought. So now

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m three bottles down on zero odor. Oh my gosh. But it is working.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco Like the areas that I spray, then a few days later, actually do smell

⏹️ ▶️ Marco less. Or like

⏹️ ▶️ John nothing. Or it’s just slowly killing your olfactory receptors so you can’t smell anything anymore.

⏹️ ▶️ Casey Potato, potato.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I eventually bought this thing called Zero Odor Pro, which… Of course you did. I think it’s just

⏹️ ▶️ Marco the same thing in a bigger bottle. It

⏹️ ▶️ John just has the newer SOC in

⏹️ ▶️ Marco it. Yeah. So now I have the large

⏹️ ▶️ Marco bottle, the full-size bottle, which I have right here, Zero Odor Pro. The other day I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco sprayed every surface in the office that was soft. The window

⏹️ ▶️ Marco blinds, the acoustic tiles, the The acoustic panels, the rug, the dog bed,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco not the dog, the cushion, I like doused the cushion because everyone says like if you like

⏹️ ▶️ Marco you got to for it to work you got it has to be like damp like when you’re done it has to you have to really spray a lot.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I sprayed every single service in the office. It was unbearable to be in here for

⏹️ ▶️ Marco like for like the entire 24 hours after that period. It was way too much. I

⏹️ ▶️ Marco definitely should not have done that in such a small space to that density of spray

⏹️ ▶️ Marco in one day. It was unbearable. However,

⏹️ ▶️ Marco now it is a few days later and the smell is, I think, totally

⏹️ ▶️ Marco gone for the first time in three weeks. I feel like I’ve finally won.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I have defeated the cologne. I’ve defeated the Febreze. I’ve defeated

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John the air

⏹️ ▶️ John fresheners. I’m not sure you defeated anything. It may be that time defeated these things. So here’s the thing with smells,

⏹️ ▶️ John right? If you remove the source of the smell and you just have lingering things that

⏹️ ▶️ John have picked up the smell, most smells, the reason you smell them, I mean, VOCs are volatile organic

⏹️ ▶️ John compounds, is that things that smell bad tend to be volatile, which means they are reacting with everything.

⏹️ ▶️ John They are reacting with the air, which means if the source of them is gone, eventually

⏹️ ▶️ John all of those volatile compounds will react with just the air in the room and they will go away. Now that may

⏹️ ▶️ John take a long time. I fed them so much air. Right, well, but I’m just saying, it may

⏹️ ▶️ John take a lot of time. And yes, having contact with more air will speed that process up, but it may take a while, right?

⏹️ ▶️ John A lot of what you were actually looking for in the case where you’re trying to, quote unquote, get rid of a smell, I don’t

⏹️ ▶️ John know what the solution is to cologne, but for things like a lot of pet odors, where it’s organic compounds, as

⏹️ ▶️ John in pet pee or poo and stuff like that, or anal gland secretions and all sorts of stuff like that, or even skunk

⏹️ ▶️ John odor, there are things that you can buy specifically for whatever it is, like

⏹️ ▶️ John say your dog got skunked, which happened to me. I learned the hard way that there’s lots of these folk remedies or whatever,

⏹️ ▶️ John but what you really want is a tailor made product that will cause the volatile

⏹️ ▶️ John compounds in skunk spray to react much, much faster. So, yeah,

⏹️ ▶️ John I think we use like Nature’s Miracle brand or whatever that was specifically for skunk smell.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco I use some of that, too. Right.

⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John Forgot about that.

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco But

⏹️ ▶️ John here’s the thing. I have that and use that the very first day. Those things are tailored to reacting

⏹️ ▶️ John with whatever it is they say they’re for, whether it’s for de-skunking or animal pee or whatever, they’re

⏹️ ▶️ John almost certainly going to do nothing to cologne, which is your problem. But cologne, if it’s very smelly,

⏹️ ▶️ John probably is itself some kind of volatile compound. So what you need is either something that’s going to, quote unquote,

⏹️ ▶️ John absorb odor like baking powder or charcoal, activated charcoal, whatever. Try baking powder the very first day.

⏹️ ▶️ John Right. But better yet, you need something that will react with this thing to sort of burn it out faster.

⏹️ ▶️ John But but I don’t know what the heck you would ever get to react with cologne,

⏹️ ▶️ John right? All these products are made for like your pet had an accident or you got skunked or something, right?

⏹️ ▶️ John And they’re tailor-made to those, whatever is the smelly thing in cat pee or

⏹️ ▶️ John in skunk spray, right? But I don’t think cologne hopefully uses any of the same ingredients

⏹️ ▶️ John as cat pee or skunk spray. So that’s probably why you had a hard time. So I don’t know what your solution should have been, but that’s

⏹️ ▶️ John what you’re looking for. You’re not looking for a thing that will add a piney scent or whatever. Now maybe that zero

⏹️ ▶️ John odor thing is that, but I wonder if it’s formulated for cologne or if it’s

⏹️ ▶️ John just sort of like nuke everything and try to react with everything that you come in contact with

⏹️ ▶️ John and burn it out. But I think the other plausible theory is if you had done literally nothing,

⏹️ ▶️ John your room would smell the same now, except for maybe with less of a pine scent because it would have eventually burned

⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco itself out.

⏹️ ▶️ John Because you, yeah, it would have eventually burned itself out no matter what over the course of a week because that’s just what smells

⏹️ ▶️ John do. If you’ve removed the source of the smell and if there’s no new smell coming in, it should eventually

⏹️ ▶️ John sort of burn itself out. Even if there was a pile of poop in your room, if you wait a year, your room won’t smell like poo anymore because the

⏹️ ▶️ John pile of poo will be all just dried out and just, you know, like obviously that’s the worst case scenario.

⏹️ ▶️ John But anyway, what you did is I think a good lesson in the fact that you can’t cover up smells.

⏹️ ▶️ John Beep, beep, beep.